X Marks the Scot - An on-line community of kilt wearers.

   X Marks Partners - (Go to the Partners Dedicated Forums )
USA Kilts website Celtic Croft website Celtic Corner website Houston Kiltmakers

User Tag List

Results 1 to 10 of 23

Hybrid View

  1. #1
    Join Date
    12th February 13
    Posts
    35
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)

    How did the kilt develop?

    This is my first post so be gentle

    I can see from some of the posts that there are a few well researched folks while others are less into the history side of things.

    This has possibly been covered before but I thought I would give a quick outline of where the kilt came from, or how it developed at least...according to my understanding of McClintocks theory.

    c.2,000 years ago, the proto-Irish/Scots wore the usual European (barbarian ) attire of short wool jacket, short cloak and trousers/early trews.

    Although the Romans were unable to overcome the Irish/Scots/Picts they nevertheless influenced those around them with whom they traded, fought and married etc. One of those areas was in clothing fashion. So the Irish/Scots aristocracy adopted the Roman style of tunica and toga, while the lower orders maintained the traditional fashion of short jacket, trews and short cloak.

    This was the fashion of these peoples through many centuries (I'm sure there were variations and additions to this but the basic fashion remained over the years).

    During the middle ages 13th/14th centuries the two styles came together and the short jacket, trews and brat (large cloak) along with a long tunica or leine became the norm for the next several centuries.

    The leine was frowned upon by the centralising English government because of its abundent use of cloth. With the encroaching English colonisation of Ireland during the 16th century the leine seemed to reduce in volume.

    According to McClintock, the trews were not particularly tailored around the body and the long leine served the added purpose of hiding this. As the leine reduced over the 16th century the brát cloak) began to be used as a means of disguising the top of the trews, eventually the brát was lengthened over the waist and the filidhmór was born

    Thats my understanding - I stand to be corrected...Slán.

  2. #2
    Join Date
    7th July 09
    Location
    Melbourne,Victoria Australia
    Posts
    3,439
    Mentioned
    2 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    For a good read I suggest you have a look and the New House Highland site ( advertiser at the bottom of the page) and read some of Matt Newsomes blog section. Covers all you need to know re the kilt, tartan and a whole heap of other things to do with scottish wear
    Shoot straight you bastards. Don't make a mess of it. Harry (Breaker) Harbord Morant - Bushveldt Carbineers

  3. #3
    Join Date
    18th July 07
    Location
    North East Scotland
    Posts
    1,027
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Henry,
    We know from Bishop Leslie that the Highlanders of the mid 1500s wore short trews to facilitate wading through wet vegetation/rivers etc. and a brat plus feileadh (blanket) round the shoulders and this ties in with the well known picture by de Heere shown here

    Click image for larger version. 

Name:	deheare_zps8d59796b.jpg 
Views:	3 
Size:	55.4 KB 
ID:	11116

    (I see no reason to believe the suggestion that this picture has been altered.)

    I feel it is more likely that, around 1580, someone first stuffed the feileadh through a waistbelt to make carrying it easier than that the brat became longer. I doubt if any changes in length of leine etc. would have had much influence on what was going on in Highland Scotland by that point in history. Of course, one should also recogniset that there was probably great variation in Highland dress in relation to location, social class, age etc. with a good deal of external influence on the periphery of the Highlands.
    Alan
    Last edited by neloon; 28th April 13 at 04:45 AM.

  4. #4
    Join Date
    2nd October 04
    Location
    Page/Lake Powell, Arizona USA
    Posts
    14,268
    Mentioned
    3 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    No kilt historian. Always figured common sense - that certain parts of the body NEED to adjust to variations in temperature and kilts provided that FREEDOM.
    Ol' Macdonald himself, a proud son of Skye and Cape Breton Island
    Lifetime Member STA. Two time winner of Utilikiltarian of the Month.
    "I'll have a kilt please, a nice hand sewn tartan, 16 ounce Strome. Oh, and a sporran on the side, with a strap please."

  5. #5
    Join Date
    12th February 13
    Posts
    35
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by neloon View Post
    Henry,
    We know from Bishop Leslie that the Highlanders of the mid 1500s wore short trews to facilitate wading through wet vegetation/rivers etc. and a brat plus feileadh (blanket) round the shoulders and this ties in with the well known picture by de Heere shown here

    http://media-cache0.pinterest.com/up...Eqpj3rjk_c.jpg

    (I see no reason to believe the suggestion that this picture has been altered.)

    I feel it is more likely that, around 1580, someone first stuffed the feileadh through a waistbelt to make carrying it easier than that the brat became longer. I doubt if any changes in length of leine etc. would have had much influence on what was going on in Highland Scotland by that point in history. Of course, one should also recogniset that there was probably great variation in Highland dress in relation to location, social class, age etc. with a good deal of external influence on the periphery of the Highlands.
    Alan
    ***

  6. #6
    Join Date
    8th June 04
    Location
    Port Crane, New York
    Posts
    2,531
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Brian

    "They who can give up essential liberty to obtain a little temporary safety, deserve neither liberty nor safety." ~ Benjamin Franklin

  7. #7
    Join Date
    18th July 07
    Location
    North East Scotland
    Posts
    1,027
    Mentioned
    1 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Woodsheal View Post
    Useful for re-enactors, I'm sure, but largely a re-hash of old stuff such as McClintock. His book was a great step forward at the time of publication but it needs to be remembered that his intention was to demonstrate that the kilt was not Irish in origin. However, in doing this, he seems to have left an impression in some quarters that Irish and Highland dress were much more closely related than in reality they were. Recent archaeological work has shown that the Irish and Highland q-Celts, though sharing a common language, were otherwise separate culturally. With that in mind, I think the emphasis in the OP on the leine etc. is not quite right vis-a-vis the feileadh.
    Alan

  8. #8
    Join Date
    12th February 13
    Posts
    35
    Mentioned
    0 Post(s)
    Tagged
    0 Thread(s)
    Quote Originally Posted by Woodsheal View Post
    Thanks Brian...I love this:

    ...a description of Scottish soldiers from the Hebrides in Ireland (fighting for Red Hugh O’Donnell in 1594) that makes clear that they had sufficiently different appearance from the Irish soldiers that an observer could tell them apart. They are described as wearing their belts over their mantles,which sounds to me like a description of the belted plaid — the first kilt:

    “They [the Scottish soliders] were recognized among the Irish Soldiers by the distinction of their arms and clothing, their habits and language, for their exterior dress was mottled cloaks of many colours (breacbhrait ioldathacha) with a fringe to their shins and calves, their belts over their loins outside their cloaks. Many of them had swords with hafts of horn, large and warlike, over their shoulders. It was necessary for the soldier to grip the very haft of his sword with both hands when he would strike a blow with it. Others of them had bows of carved wood strong for use, with well-seasoned strings of hemp, and arrows sharp-pointed whizzing in flight.” (Quoted in McClintock, Old Highland Dress, p. 18: The Life of Aodh Ruadh O Domhnaill transcribed from the book of Lughaid O’Cleirigh. Irish Texts Society’s publications, vol. XLII. Part I. Page 73.)


    Brilliant, thats an amazing description and I agree, its undoubtedly the filleadh mór thats being described.

Bookmarks

Posting Permissions

  • You may not post new threads
  • You may not post replies
  • You may not post attachments
  • You may not edit your posts
  •  

» Log in

User Name:

Password:

Not a member yet?
Register Now!
Powered by vBadvanced CMPS v4.2.0