Scots-Irish

[Blackrose87]

I think if you were to do a poll among those claiming Scots-Irish and/or Irish descent here in the US, you would find that there are widely varying degrees of awareness of personal/family history and interest in Ulster/NI/Irish history and current events. My grandfather always told my father that we were Scots-Irish. I don't know if he was making a pun on the fact that our surname is Scott and his mother was from Ireland (Toome, County Antrim, in fact). I hevn't been able to trace my family back far enough to find the connection back across the Atlantic.

We're also limited by the rules on this forum from discussion of The Troubles, etc., but I'm sure many people (both here and in the general population) are at least peripherally aware of them, as Lyle1 suggested, even if they don't know the entire history and causes.

As Jeff (ForresterModern) and others have said, the various waves of immigration of Ulster-Scots (generally called Scots-Irish here) followed by the Irish-Irish and Scots the the U.S. were more focused on day-to-day survival and becoming integrated into their local communities rather than maintaining the traditions and speech from home. In fact, many immigrants in the early- to mid-1800's were actively discouraged from doing so (look up the Bloody Monday riots here in Louisville as an example). Regarding traditions and prcitices carried over, their children were often told (in effect) "That doesn't matter now. We're in America and you're an American now! Forget about that stuff!"

I find it diappointing that more people don't take an interest in history (their own and history in general). As George Santayana wrote: "Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it."


You might also want to take note that the prevailing term these days is Scots-Irish rather than Scotch-Irish (Scotch being an adult beverage and a trademarked brand of 3M tape).

Thanks, very helpfull indeed. It reminds me of the saying by Nobel peace prize winner and fellow Derryman John Hume, "You can't eat a flag". Basically nationalism and culture are all well and good, but they're not going to put food on the table.

Btw Actually either Scots or Scotch can be used here when referred to those of Scottish ancestry in Ulster. Scotch is merely the Ullans version of the word i.e the government body Ulster-Scots agency is Boord o Ulstèr-Scotch.
But if that's not how it's done in America, I'll stick to Scots-Irish from now on.

[Bugbear]

Thanks, very helpfull indeed. It reminds me of the saying by Nobel peace prize winner and fellow Derryman John Hume, "You can't eat a flag". Basically nationalism and culture are all well and good, but they're not going to put food on the table.

Btw Actually either Scots or Scotch can be used here when referred to those of Scottish ancestry in Ulster. Scotch is merely the Ullans version of the word i.e the government body Ulster-Scots agency is Boord o Ulstèr-Scotch.
But if that's not how it's done in America, I'll stick to Scots-Irish from now on.

In my experience on the forum, it is also the Scots who take issue with the use of the word "Scotch" used that way.
I'm not a historian, and find many discussions intimidating, or at least have the feeling that I lag very, very far behind most of the forum members in Scottish and related history. All I can do is get more books to read.

[Blackrose87]

In my experience on the forum, it is also the Scots who take issue with the use of the word "Scotch" used that way.
I'm not a historian, and find many discussions intimidating, or at least have the feeling that I lag very, very far behind most of the forum members in Scottish and related history. All I can do is get more books to read.

Maybe it's a uniquely Irish thing. Come to think of it, I don't think I've ever seen the word Scotch used that way here in Scotland. Haven't really ever thought about it until now.

[SlackerDrummer]

You might also want to take note that the prevailing term these days is Scots-Irish rather than Scotch-Irish (Scotch being an adult beverage and a trademarked brand of 3M tape).

But that's just politically correct backlash.

[Blackrose87]

After googling a few articles about Scots/Scotch, it appears the in regards to Scotland it's only Scotch when referring to a specific product; whisky, Sellotape etc.
But in regards to Ulster-Scots they can be used interchangeable and really just depend on the speaker and context.

But it's all semantics really. I wudnae fash yersel wi thon!

[Bugbear]

Has anyone read, War on the Run: The Epic Story Of Robert Rogers and the Conquest of America's First Frontier, by John F. Ross (Random House, 2009), and is it worth reading?

It looks like Rogers's parents were Scots-Irish immigrants, so might have some related information.

[McElmurry]

But it's all semantics really. I wudnae fash yersel wi thon!

I try not to flash myself at all.

[Blackrose87]

I try not to flash myself at all.

It means worry/trouble

[Blackrose87]

Sorry if I'm being a bit slow here, I'm just trying to learn! But I do t think anyone has pointed out the distinct differences in culture between Scots-Americans and Scotch-Irish-Americans.
Is there any differences? Or are Scotch-Irish now basically Scots in America?

[Peter Crowe]

I try not to flash myself at all.

Don't be embarrassed it's fash not flash, which as Blackrose87 stated is the Scots for worry/bother/trouble.