Whatever has happened to manners

**artificer** · 25th October 11, 07:20 AM

Originally Posted by Peter Crowe

As to giving your seat to a lady on a bus, my dad customarily did that until the 1970's when he was one time fiercely rebuked by a pregnant lady for offering her his seat. For younger men such acts of chivalry can be viewed with the suspicion that you are 'coming on' to the lady concerned. However, if I see someone obviously struggling with something heavy, I will offer to help.

I'm very on-the-fence about teaching my little boy this style of manners for just the sort of reason above.

I was taught to hold the door (for men and women, and then a gent further back would pick up the duty as he reached the door), to let women pass in front, etc.

It grows harder and harder to continue these habits when you're either ignored as if you were a doorman (which is another terrible set of manners) or given the "evil eye" as if you were "up to something".

It's doubly frustrating to end up holding a busy door for what seems an eternity, while 'gentleman' after 'gentleman' walk on through, it never seeming to register with them that they could take up the duty.

In the end I'm sure I will continue to teach my son these manners, along with the knowledge that there's a time and place to set them aside (so as to not be a doormat)

ith:

**EHCAlum** · 25th October 11, 07:27 AM

It's actually a royal pet peeve of mine to be called Mr. Andy.

I've been accused of flirting/coming on with women just because I'm a nice and gentlemanly guy. My stepdad taught me his British boys school manners and my mother was a probation officer.....

**cessna152towser** · 25th October 11, 07:38 AM

Derek you are a true ambassador for the cilt!

**piperdbh** · 25th October 11, 08:40 AM

When I hold a door for someone to walk through, and then someone else walks through as if I'm part of the furniture whose existence is centered around holding the door for them, I thank them, aloud, for walking through my door. Or, sometimes, I'll say, again aloud, "You're welcome".

I take my fun where I can find it.

**creagdhubh** · 25th October 11, 09:18 AM

Originally Posted by piperdbh

When I hold a door for someone to walk through, and then someone else walks through as if I'm part of the furniture whose existence is centered around holding the door for them, I thank them, aloud, for walking through my door. Or, sometimes, I'll say, again aloud, "You're welcome".

I take my fun where I can find it.

Well stated!

**creagdhubh** · 25th October 11, 09:19 AM

Originally Posted by artificer

I'm very on-the-fence about teaching my little boy this style of manners for just the sort of reason above.

I was taught to hold the door (for men and women, and then a gent further back would pick up the duty as he reached the door), to let women pass in front, etc.

It grows harder and harder to continue these habits when you're either ignored as if you were a doorman (which is another terrible set of manners) or given the "evil eye" as if you were "up to something".

It's doubly frustrating to end up holding a busy door for what seems an eternity, while 'gentleman' after 'gentleman' walk on through, it never seeming to register with them that they could take up the duty.

In the end I'm sure I will continue to teach my son these manners, along with the knowledge that there's a time and place to set them aside (so as to not be a doormat)

ith:

Well said!

**Lyle1** · 25th October 11, 10:18 AM

Originally Posted by creagdhubh

I have seen countless times, where the people that are forced to stand, due a crowded bus, are women. Not one time as any man stood up and offered his seat to one of the ladies - and often times there have been men sitting at very close distances. ,

While I agree that people are not as considerate of others as they once were, I also think that as social values change, so to should manners change. Women are no longer considered frail beings who are constantly in need of the care and protection of randomly encountered males. Women have proved that they can compete both in the workplace and in society, and that they are quite capable of taking care of themselves. When I commuted to work on crowded urban transit, I did not automatically give up my seat so a women could sit, though I did give up my seat to people who I thought needed to sit more than I did. I am more than twice your age, and I have given up my seat countless times to people who were both older and younger than I, and who were more in need of a seat. To consider a person to be less capable of standing (weaker?) because of their gender is no longer considered gentlemanly behavior, and what can be meant as a nice gesture can be considered insulting.

Many years ago, one of my sisters-in-law was embarrassed because a man gave up his seat on the bus on the way home from work so she could sit down. She accepted the seat only because she was visible pregnant, could not get off the bus, and needed to sit. She felt that most of the people on that bus were on their way home from work, were as tired as she was, and had as much right to a seat as she did. Her normal habit during her pregnancy was to only get on the bus if she knew there were empty seats before she boarded, but that day she miscounted; if there were no empty seats, she would wait for the next bus so that no one would need to stand on her account.

**Jock Scot** · 25th October 11, 10:27 AM

Lyle1.

I quite understand your sister-in-law's predicament, but I would like to think that a gentleman would offer his seat nonetheless and there is nothing to say that the offer HAS to be accepted-----and if the lady so wishes, the kind gesture is declined, graciously.

**Meggers** · 25th October 11, 11:34 AM

Originally Posted by Downunder Kilt

Derek, Derek, Derek did you not realise that manners, such as you are talking about, are in the most, only for people born prior to the 1970's maybe the 1980's

heeeeeey now... This young lady was taught her manners. Manners are disappearing but it's not just limited to 70s and 80s babies....except I am 1989 so maybe I still apply to that. ;)

**piperchris** · 25th October 11, 12:24 PM

While I certainly agree with you, Derek, and the others that posted on this thread about the lack of manners in today's society, I would also say that I would have helped this person out because she is old and weak NOT because she is female. Women's liberation killed chivalry and Equality means Equal Responsibilty. I hope, Derek, that you would have shown the same courtesy and helpfulness to an elderly man in the same situation.