More about traditional jackets

[OC Richard]

We have to keep in mind that what we think of as a Scottish military doublet (with the gauntlet cuffs and flaps or skirts around the bottom) went FROM civilian Highland dress TO the military and not the other way round.

Doublets (and Glengarries) first came into the Army as the dress of pipers, who were more or less dressed in livery rather than the uniform that the rest of the regiment wore. They for whatever reason spread from the dress of the pipers alone to the rest of the regiment.

The Army didn't adopt doublets for the entire Scottish infantry until 1855 but they had been worn by some of the pipers for decades before and were originally a civilian style. (Ditto Glengarries.)

If one looks through hundreds of 19th century photographs of kilted men in civilian Highland Dress, and looks through The Highlanders of Scotland (1860s, showing precisely the same dress as photographs of the same period) one is struck by a number of things:

1) there was a greater variety of jacket styles at that time than today
2) jackets were often more plain than "kilt jackets" are now, often with utterly plain cuffs, lacking epaulettes, etc.
3) our modern suite of Evening jackets (Prince Charlie, Montrose, Sherriffmuir, Kenmore) did not exist.

The equivalent to our "Day Dress" tweed kilt jackets were nearly always light to mid grey, less often brown, and were usually utterly plain. They were, in fact, often exactly the same jacket as one would wear with trousers at that time. Sometimes they were cut shorter to suit the kilt, sometimes not. The tweed almost never has any pattern to it.

For Evening Dress, the most common style was a style very similar to the military doublet of the same period, with flaps and cuffs, made of black fabric and silver buttons. What distinguished it from the military jacket was its open collar with lapels. Also fairly common was utterly plain black jackets, jackets which we today would hardly consider suitable for Evening Dress. One is struck by all the finery often worn with Evening Dress at that time (waistbelt, crossbelt, plaid, weaponry) which makes one tend to not notice the plainness of the jacket itself.

[OC Richard]

So here you can see a piper of the 93rd Highlanders wearing a doublet before doublets were introduced into the army. Pipers in the early 19th century can be seen wearing all sorts of non-military garb such as tartan jackets, different bonnets, etc



see this recent thread to see many photos I posted showing 19th century kilt jackets

http://www.xmarksthescot.com/forum/f...-jacket-81767/

Here's a jacket exactly as would be worn with trousers

[OC Richard]

Here are flaps appearing on a Highland doublet 150 years before the Army adopted them




and the Glengarry worn in civilian attire a quarter-century before being adopted by the Army


On the topic of plainness, note the piper in the centre. A casual glance would make one think that he's in military dress like the soldier to the left, but look at his jacket: utterly plain.



Doublets with trim all over, like the one on the right, aren't common at that time but become very popular around 1900 (though usually not tan!)

[Farmer Jones]

dukeofargyll.jpg

This image shows the 11th Duke of Argyll. I think it was taken sometime in the 1950s. The military origins of the jacket style are obvious. What is of note to me is that he is wearing his dirk belt over his jacket and that he has a dirk with knife and fork hanging on the right side. So he has both his sgian dubh and dirk on the same side. The other thing is that instead of silver buttons he has what appear to be fish. I am pretty sure that this is "formal" attire. What has changed since then is that the formal jacket is now a PC, and the dirk belt is not used with that. That would mean that the dirk also is no longer carried formally.

[McMurdo]

The dirk can still be carried formally, though I suspect it is not carried as often as it once was. Here is a photo of me from a few years back giving the Address to the Haggis on Burns night. As I was about to dispatch the wee beasty I was wearing my dirk.

[Liam]

The dirk can still be carried formally, though I suspect it is not carried as often as it once was. Here is a photo of me from a few years back giving the Address to the Haggis on Burns night. As I was about to dispatch the wee beasty I was wearing my dirk.

Great picture Glen....

[Farmer Jones]

The dirk can still be carried formally, though I suspect it is not carried as often as it once was. Here is a photo of me from a few years back giving the Address to the Haggis on Burns night. As I was about to dispatch the wee beasty I was wearing my dirk.

And you look so good doing it.

[TheKiltedLaird]

For my part a jacket is a the outer garment suited to the outing for which the kilt is to be worn. I personally prefer a standard tweed jacket not unlike this one. My style.jpg

[MonkeyRogue]

Most of the jackets I've seen are cut considerably shorter to allow full display of the kilt. Would be a fashion faux pax to wear a standard length coat? I see from these archive pictures and even our own TheKiltedLaird seem to be wearing them. I ask because I greatly admire the doublet look, (I'd probably find excuses to start wearing the doublet), but won't have the funds to get a full ensemble for some time. Later, it may not be a big deal to get a tweed jacket with scalloped pockets and gauntlet cuffs and I readdress the full kit at that time.

[Nathan]

dukeofargyll.jpg What has changed since then is that the formal jacket is now a PC, and the dirk belt is not used with that. That would mean that the dirk also is no longer carried formally.

As you may have deduced from McMurdo's photo, there is more than one kind of formal jacket now. The PC is a popular choice, but there is debate about whether it is formal enough for white tie. It certainly appears that it was in the 30s when it was conceived, but many treat it like a tuxedo today which is a step below formal in the British sense.

Here are a couple of other formal jacket options for you to examine that are still worn today.

AGM_Final_sm.jpg

MacLeodofMacLeod1.jpg

new doublet.jpg