Where marketing fails with flying colors.

[Kevin Murphy]

I am going to try and give you the tree and not the forest. These are points I am trying to set up tge bigger picture here without arousing confusion.

1. Murphy is the most common surname in Ireland and more Murphy's exist outside Ireland than within.

2. Kilts can be worn by anyone whether you believe it or not it is physically possible. Let's face it though, regardless of the origins of kilts and opinions can we agree that a lot of Irish people especially in the United States make up a fairly large portion of the DEMOGRAPHIC of kilt wearers kilt enthusiasts?

3. If 1 and 2 are true than there is a seriious problem with the business people who are interested in selling kilts.

If you have a demographic of people who are not being drawn into the culture then there is something that is being neglected. Maybe some questions that should be addressed by persons looking to keep the culture alive would be :

Who are our target groups? Demographic information...
What makes kilt culture special?
Are people turned off because they feel left out are there people asking where is my family tartan?
Regardless of exclusiveness to clan, regardless of history, is there a REALITY in the importance of family and the desire to have a kilt in a family tartan that exists in the average persons mind and is it not a really stupid practice to just not bother to reach out and try to make that a possibility for someone.
If a man wants a McFillinaname tartan that simply does not exist then what better way to tell a man **** you than to say oh it does not exist but 1000 dollars and I can make it happen. That is a pathetic attitude I have seen and it is an incredibly dumb business practice. That is where I feel there is a failure in the structure of the industry of tartans.

This effects people who just want a kilt, the potential sales for kilts tailors, and the weavers themselves. The weavers themselves are where the problem starts. If you don't want to see outsourced garbage, find a way to get your target group excited, engaged, and involved in your trade. If you have neglected your target group then we are going to ruin something really special for the next generations as interests are lost. And that makes Kevin Murphy sad.

This is meant to be thought provoking more than anything else. I am not claiming to be an expert on anything.

[Thekiltedmohawk]

I'm no expert either but.. I'm looking at your post, and separate them into three sections if you willing.

1. Yes, the Irish is the 2nd largest ethnicity group behind the Germans in the US.
However, isn't it true the small percentage of Irish do wear kilts? Is it a case of the supply and the demand for an Irish tartan related to the small percentage of the Irish to wear a kilt?

2. I think it's reasonable that in the history of tartan over the time. Irish do not have their own family/clan/sept/ tartan like the Highland Scots did. So, to come up with the market ideas like USAK's States Seal tartans to target us the Americans with no Scot blood in them to get our state pride going.. The weavers came up with the Irish National, Irish-American, the Irish countries, and the others in the Irish-related themes in their market targeting the Irish who wants to wear a kilt. Is that reasonable to you?

3. Personally, my favorite tartan is American Heritage. Whenever people asked me what is my family/clan tartan. I simply said it's just the American Heritage. Do you feel appropriate to tell them you are just a good-looking Irish that enjoys wearing a kilt, and having no Scot blood in you? Do you just want to start a trend where the Irish and their proud surname can come up with a tartan of their own for the people with the same surname can wear it with a pride like the Highland Scots do with their tartans? However, how many Murphys out there TRULY want to wear a kilt? How many out there are willing to get together, to design, and pay the foot for that tartan to be available?

That's something for the Irish have to find out. Again, it's the law of the supply and the demand, IMO.

[The Wizard of BC]

OK, here are some hard facts from here on the front lines of this business.

I have been making and selling kilts for 12 years now. I own the only brick and mortar Kilt shop on Vancouver Island with a population of over 3/4 million people.
I have a website that gets over 2.2 million visits per year from around the entire world. I have shipped kilts to ever continent including Antarctica.
Now granted I'm not ScotWeb or even USA Kilts but I do have a fairly well known name in this business. And granted I do not live and work in Boston, New York City or Chicago.

This is the fact - Not once has anyone asked me for a Murphy Tartan kilt.

Another fact - The Tara/Murphy Tartan is readily available and I carry 3 items in Tara/Murphy in my shop. I have never sold one of them.

A few more -
Fact - Ireland does not have the Clan system like the Scots.
Fact - Ireland does not have the historical association with the kilt that the Scots do.
Fact - There are currently two weaving mills that carry within their stock Tartans list (which means that they regularly weave and usually keep on hand fabrics) with a specifically Irish theme.
Fact - In addition to Tartans for every Irish County there are, at least, five more Tartans for the entire country of Ireland or for those of Irish Descent.
Fact - There are also the ubiquitous Saffron and Kelly Green fabrics readily available and often made into kilts for pipe bands.

There are no known facts or numbers for how many kilt wearers there are in the world but it is surely a very small percentage of total population. This is backed up by our members here who often say that they are the only regular kilt wearer in their area.
There are many Highland Games. While I have not polled attendance numbers in a couple of years many Games are reporting that they are expanding to include all people of Celtic heritage. Some are recording dropping attendance over the last couple of years.

Opinion - I think that the weavers and the kiltmakers are doing a pretty good job of meeting the current market demand.

[Thekiltedmohawk]

To follow up with Wizard's facts.

I look it up on the USAK's wool gallery.

There is 77 Irish-related tartan available
There is 51 State Seal tartan available
There is 40 Welsh-related tartan available
Then you have the districts, the universals, the families/clans/septs, and the other tartans out there.

I reckon the 77 Irish-related tartan from a single kiltmaker's company is pretty generous for a small percentage of the Irish kilt wearers.