Cultural Appropriation?

[Liam]

Comrades,

Excuse the intrusion but just to clarify -- the tartan kilt as we know it isn't Irish but is Scottish in origin unless I'm mistaken (which is entirely possible). Also, "Celtic" descent doesn't really matter as not all Celtic cultures had a tartan kilt. Since I currently don't live in Ireland or Scotland and am not Irish or Scottish, I will be very careful about my response to the cultural appropriation question. I agree with Jock, Steve, and CDN -- I don't think it's cultural appropriation in this situation at all. If I were to get tattooed with spiritual and sacred images of another culture, or to wear another culture's spiritual head-dress then that's an entirely different story.

(Further, which I hesitate to include ... but six of my eight great-grandparents were born in Ireland and subsequently moved to the US. I have spent years traveling and living in Ireland, I am a fluent Irish-speaker, and play traditional music but I don't consider myself Irish. I'm American ... yes, with Irish background but when people ask, "Are you Irish?" my response is "No, I'm American." One doesn't have to be French to enjoy French wine or to speak French after all.)

Regards,
Jonathan

Jonathon.... While you are American by citizenship, you are by your own account Irish by heritage. You are not an Irish citizen, but you do seem to have embraced Irish culture. It is important not to confuse citizenship, heritage and culture.

[jthk]

Jonathon.... While you are American by citizenship, you are by your own account Irish by heritage. You are not an Irish citizen, but you do seem to have embraced Irish culture. It is important not to confuse citizenship, heritage and culture.

Liam,

Exactly. Even though I have thought on those distinctions and have conducted basic research in that field, I still wouldn't use the adjective to describe myself as Irish. Some colleagues in the Irish language community in Ireland have referred to me, essentially, as being "Gaelic" but I'll leave it to them to make that call as I'll continue to simply refer to myself as an American because, as far as I'm concerned, it's the most accurate without any confusion. It's interesting to me to find other Americans with Irish background repeatedly referring to themselves as "Irish" yet they have never been to the island nor could they identify, say, the President or Prime Minister (Taoiseach). Further, the claim of "I'm 2/3 Irish" etc. ... which 2/3 of you? The upper torso and arms? In my worldview, it's a very strange thing to claim -- in my mind, you are Irish or you're not.

Rambles.
Jonathan

[Taskr]

Thank you, CDN
Too often individuals and organizations go off the deep end trying to be correct whilst making an abomination of the tenent they imagine they are protecting.
A corporate/society/organization tartan is absolutely fine (Thanks for that, Steve) and need not only be a kilt - even though it can also be.

[terry m]

Personally I do not think that the wearing of tartan is an appropriation of Scottish culture any more than porridge for breakfast, a drink of single malt or haggis neeps and tattles at Hogmanay.
Soccer is deeply rooted in English culture but I love to see soccer shirts being worn all over the world, after all someone had to teach us how to play, lol.
Tradition has a tendency to travel with its own folk to all corners of the globe and honest imitation surely is a form of flattery and respect.
The only Celtic blood I have personally is Welsh on my maternal side but I am proud of my wife and her Scottish roots hence my own wish to wear her tartan on the kilt.

[freep]

When asked am I Scots or what have you, I usually reply, "Made in America of Scots and Welsh parts, mostly."
If asked how I know (this comes up when I mention I was adopted at birth) I can recite chapter and verse of the DNA tests and a fair bit of genealogical research.

[Angstrom]

A corporate/society/organization tartan is absolutely fine (Thanks for that, Steve) and need not only be a kilt - even though it can also be.

Exactly. Tartan fabric can be use to make scarves, ties, and a host of other items that an organization could use for building identity. For example: http://www.stniniantartan.com/shop.html

[Tarheel]

Late to the thread but read through. Good points on all sides.
I would address the trend of fashion with the corporate image of designing a tartan Kyle. I still think IBM when I see a grey suit, even though any IT nerd (like my wife) will wear what they want in the business world. The same goes for the brown of UPS or blue of the US Postal service.
A fabric design that can be utilized in any type of apparel (tie, shirt, kilt, cap or socks) will give folks the idea that your company is represented. The idea of belonging to the larger collective is met with a personally chosen clothing item, even when fashion trends change.

[MacRobert's Reply]

What we wear does communicate something about who and what we are. Tartan by itself is unlikely to imply that one is Scottish but turn that tartan into a kilt and you have the defining garment of Scottish highland dress. Wear a tartan kilt and you have on something that developed in the unique culture of the Scottish highlands.
By all means design a corporate tartan, have it made into kilts and enjoy the experience of wearing them. As a native Scot I have no problem seeing kilts worn by other nations and cultures ... immitation is indeed a kind of flattery. I only cringe when I see it worn as a comic-opera costume!
There are many here who are not Scots but wear the kilt with respect for its origins and with greater awareness and sensitivity than many of my fellow Scots.

[DWFII]

What we wear does communicate something about who and what we are.
I only cringe when I see it worn as a comic-opera costume!
There are many here who are not Scots but wear the kilt with respect for its origins and with greater awareness and sensitivity than many of my fellow Scots.

All clothing...whether we like it or not says something about who we are...and more importantly about how much and what we want to reveal about who we are.

I think a person can respect and revere their Scottish ancestry without being a citizen of Scotland. And I think if a person is truly mindful of what "respect" means and implies...and wears the kilt with respect for its Traditions...then it is not cultural appropriation. Maybe it's costume but all clothing is. Maybe it's posing/pretense but again all clothing is, to some extent. Only naked are we completely without artifice.

And in my opinion to wear the kilt with respect, you have to do it right. You have to, again, respect the kilt's Traditions, and its antecedents--respect it for what it is and has been, and not for what you want it to be. In that regard, tartan is almost the defining aspect of the Scottish kilt.

Anything else just piles pretense on pretense...in my opinion.

The main reason...again in my opinion...that people wear the kilt whether it be in Scotland or New Zealand or Nova Scotia is so that they and their children will not forget. Not forget who they are. And where they come from. Personally, I can find nothing wrong with that.

How many actual Scottish citizens wear the kilt...with or without respect? Not many, AFAIK. The real question in all this is..why not?

Maybe they want to forget??

[Steve Ashton]

This article on Tartan today was written by Brian Wilton, former director of The Scottish Tartans Authority.
Brian is also the author of the coffee table book "Tartans" published by Aurumpress. (It's the book with the Tartan covered VW bug on the cover)

The article is worth the read.

http://www.tartansauthority.com/tartan/tartan-today/