The Ghillie Shirt

[PatrickHughes123]

I land pretty firmly in the traditionalist camp when it comes to tartan kilts. But I also own and wear a Utilikilt, so I'm appreciative of non-traditional styles as well. I would not attempt to dissuade people from wearing non-traditional styles, but I do think there's value in discussing where the lines are drawn. It benefits those who are trying to figure all of this out.

See, this is where I stand. With most kilt-wear, I stand firmly on traditional Highland Dress. I wear a traditional tartan kilt, a full-dress sporran, a traditional kilt pin with a kilt belt and thistle belt buckle. I wear Ghillie Brogues with hose, flashes and a sgian dubh. Traditional bonnets, Glengarries and Balmorals. However, I do it with my own personal modern innovation, the Ghillie Shirt. I feel I have the balance, because I allow room for modern innovation/development. For example, tartan Balmorals and Glengarries, which are also controversial. I do however, like most people I imagine, think that tam o shanter hats are costumey and look cartoonish.

Anyway, back to the subject of the thread. The Ghillie Shirt. I think most people don't realize is that I'm not trying to look like a costume, I've trying to give off a casual romantic look while partially adhering to traditional kilt wear. I wear it as a normal shirt, not as a costume. Like other parts of Highland Dress, I wear it as normal clothing. I put it on, I wear it and then take it off, simple. I'm not advocating it as a costume piece, I'm advocating it as a shirt. I don't run up to people and say "A-hoi matey! Where's me ship and crew!?". I wear it as a shirt, I avoid making it look like a costume shop piece. I don't consider it to look like a pirate shirt.

[Allan Thomson]

I think now you've taken on board that the ghillie shirt isn't a throwback to Jacobite days that's what most of us were trying to get across. Still curious though as to why you don't consider teaming up a slashed doublet with you Ghillie shirt as it looks much better with one?

Personally I'm in the middle, I believe that you can pull off a kilt with a modern waterproof jacket and a fleece & wicking top under certain circumstances for day to day wear on the hills. But I think that it doesn't look anywhere near as smart as with Tweeds or with more formal attire, but there's a time & a place for everything.

Not personally a fan of the scrumpled down socks look or utilikilts, but each to their own.

[Luke MacGillie]

See, this is where I stand. With most kilt-wear, I stand firmly on traditional Highland Dress. I wear a traditional tartan kilt, a full-dress sporran, a traditional kilt pin with a kilt belt and thistle belt buckle. I wear Ghillie Brogues with hose, flashes and a sgian dubh. Traditional bonnets, Glengarries and Balmorals. However, I do it with my own personal modern innovation, the Ghillie Shirt. I feel I have the balance, because I allow room for modern innovation/development. For example, tartan Balmorals and Glengarries, which are also controversial. I do however, like most people I imagine, think that tam o shanter hats are costumey and look cartoonish.

Anyway, back to the subject of the thread. The Ghillie Shirt. I think most people don't realize is that I'm not trying to look like a costume, I've trying to give off a casual romantic look while partially adhering to traditional kilt wear. I wear it as a normal shirt, not as a costume. Like other parts of Highland Dress, I wear it as normal clothing. I put it on, I wear it and then take it off, simple. I'm not advocating it as a costume piece, I'm advocating it as a shirt. I don't run up to people and say "A-hoi matey! Where's me ship and crew!?". I wear it as a shirt, I avoid making it look like a costume shop piece. I don't consider it to look like a pirate shirt.

If someone came up to you and asked where are your Buccaneers what would your response be?

[ShaunMaxwell]

But would you wear your Ghillie shirt with jeans, khakis or a blazer?

If it’s “just a shirt” and not a bit of costume, seems like it should be versatile...

SM

[figheadair]

See, this is where I stand. With most kilt-wear, I stand firmly on traditional Highland Dress. I wear a traditional tartan kilt, a full-dress sporran, a traditional kilt pin with a kilt belt and thistle belt buckle. I wear Ghillie Brogues with hose, flashes and a sgian dubh. Traditional bonnets, Glengarries and Balmorals.

This is perhaps the nub of a lot of the comments here. Traditional means different things to different people. There's no standard definition of when usage becomes tradition, many wold not consider Ghillies Brogues or a Thistle Belt Buckle traditional.

I do however, like most people I imagine, think that tam o shanter hats are costumey and look cartoonish.

I suggest that you don't say that within earshot of members of the Royal Regiment of Scotland .

[tripleblessed]

Fair point, and agreed. But that's a bit of a red herring in this discussion. Since you quoted me in your reply, I'll assume you're responding to my input here. I think I have stated quite clearly that there is indeed much room for variance, did I not? It's a sort of disclaimer that has to be often repeated around here. In other words, you're rebutting a point I never made, since I did not state (nor did I imply) that there's only one way to wear the kilt.

{Rebutting, no. Responding, yes. In the way that having passed a photo on a billboard you might think of a train you took two years ago. It's a thought I've repeatedly had over time reading comments by many. As I've said {elsewhere, I am way more in agreement with you than not, and enjoy how
{thoughtful and complete and on point your thinking is.}


What happens more often than not is that people who are new to the kilt come to this forum and ask questions about how to wear it correctly. It's rather unhelpful to just tell them that there are no traditions, and to just figure it out however they see fit. No, I think the most helpful way to discuss wearing the kilt is to start with the original traditions, separate out the modern variances, and understand them all in perspective. People can then make up their minds as to which way they want to go with their own individual style. Do you find this unreasonable?

Not at all. a Merely an attempt at expanding our understanding of the role of perspectives in this process. Apparently not successful, and certainly not pointed.


I have seen a decline in both groups over the years. We used to have some rather vocal proponents of modern kilts and "alternative" kilt styles. Alan H, the "father of the X-kilt" was one of them, and he truly delighted in arguing for practical modern kilts whilst guffawing at anything traditional. He has not been active lately. And likewise, we used to have a number of traditionalists like creagdhubh, Nathan, and others who left because they felt this forum did not appreciate the traditional viewpoint. Both camps have, at one time or another, felt like they were the minority. But it doesn't have to be a competition, where one side drowns out the voice of the other. This, unfortunately, is usually what it comes down to. People feel like they need to win the forum over so that everybody sees it their way. There's room for both.

I land pretty firmly in the traditionalist camp when it comes to tartan kilts. But I also own and wear a Utilikilt, so I'm appreciative of non-traditional styles as well. I would not attempt to dissuade people from wearing non-traditional styles, but I do think there's value in discussing where the lines are drawn. It benefits those who are trying to figure all of this out.

{Yes, to both those paragraphs}

It wasn't letting me separate my comments out, or separate your quotes, so I'm interspersed. Apologies for my lack of software mastery.

[Allan Thomson]

If someone came up to you and asked where are your Buccaneers what would your response be?

On the side of your Buccanheid?....

[neloon]

On the side of your Buccanheid?....

Just possible that excellent riposte could be over the heids of our non-Scots friends.

Alan

[YOJiMBO20]

Just possible that excellent riposte could be over the heids of our non-Scots friends.

Alan

This American understood it just fine

[Tobus]

Because I failed to follow Highland Dress conventions, I apologize. I realize I should have did research before buying a kilt. I will continue to wear the Ghillie Shirt but with these personal rules taken from advice on this thread;

- No military feather plume.
- No full-dress sporran, a day sporran or at a stretch a hunting sporran.
- No fly plaid, only a day plaid is suitable.

Hi Patrick,

There’s no need for apology here. You’re on the right path, learning from others and adapting your choices as you go. Whichever direction you choose to go in the future, I think it’s great that this forum (and the many viewpoints you have read, not just mine) is a part of that. I look forward to seeing how you adapt your attire in the years ahead as you pick up new components.

On plaids, there are a lot of past discussions worth reading. This item is usually not worn for everyday occasions, and can come across as a little costumish on its own, regardless of type. It has its place, but for normal doings, it tends to “over-egg the cake” as Jock Scot likes to say. Up to you, of course, but it is a very traditional piece with conventions of its own that are worth knowing

Anyway, back to the subject of the thread. The Ghillie Shirt. I think most people don't realize is that I'm not trying to look like a costume, I've trying to give off a casual romantic look while partially adhering to traditional kilt wear. I wear it as a normal shirt, not as a costume. Like other parts of Highland Dress, I wear it as normal clothing. I put it on, I wear it and then take it off, simple. I'm not advocating it as a costume piece, I'm advocating it as a shirt. I don't run up to people and say "A-hoi matey! Where's me ship and crew!?". I wear it as a shirt, I avoid making it look like a costume shop piece. I don't consider it to look like a pirate shirt.

Understood. It’s worth remembering, though, that your reason for wearing it and your opinion of what it represents will have no bearing on what others will think of you when they see you from afar. You don’t have to say “ahoy matey” for others to have already decided you look like a pirate if that’s their established perception. You may not care what they think, and that’s OK. But they will think it.

It just really comes down to what you wish to represent in public. Speaking strictly for myself, I don’t wish for people to think I look foolish or like I’m making a desperate cry for attention. I’m not saying you do; just explaining my own approach for what it’s worth. In the past few years I have let go of some of the more outlandish or attention-grabbing elements (even the ones firmly rooted in tradition). I’d rather people see me from a distance and think of me as a conservatively dressed and smart-looking example of someone wearing the kilt, and not as the bloke who spent his entire paycheck at a High Street tourist trap.

This is mindset sort of guides me in choosing what to wear and when it’s appropriate to wear it. I don’t need to wear full-tilt Highland kit every time I step out the door in a kilt. Time and place - context - are important to me. This may be something that is more important with age as opposed to youthful exuberance.

It seems to be popular these days to ignore public perception and encourage unique personal flair. I see a lot of people wearing it as a badge of honor to say they don’t care what anyone thinks of their manner of dress. If that makes them happy, OK. But there can be a lot of satisfaction in a more conservative approach, which is the route I’ve chosen lately. This route calls for a closer look at public perception on things like ghillie shirts and other items.

Just food for thought!