Two Ribbons on the back of the Balmoral cap.

[Tobus]

Before my time here, user creagdhubh stated that the Macphersons hold a tradition of leaving the ribbons untied.

Yes, I do recall him saying that. And I suppose there will always be traditions within small groups. I was speaking more towards the greater beliefs that tied-vs-untied actually signifies something to everyone, and it doesn't. I do find it interesting, however, that Cluny ties his in a bow which seems to indicate that the MacPherson tradition is not universal.

For questions like this, it's fun to look back at historical or vintage portraits and photographs to see if there was a pattern. I see many examples of Balmorals and Glengarries with loose tails, as well as plenty of examples where no tails are seen (this could mean they were tied in bows or had no tails at all). Unfortunately, not many historical examples exist showing the backs of peoples' heads, so there's no telling...

[CollinMacD]

OMG seems this is more complicated then I first anticipated. So I will keep bow on some and keep ribbons on others. Keep it simple....thanks for educating me on this. I know from doing American Civil War, the French Kepi, or what we referred to as the Forge Cap, many had a small linen line in a binding used to tighten the circumference to make the cap fit tighter, and those ends could stick out of the back of the cap. Shako hates made before 1849 had the same, Shako are the tall leather cylinder type hats worn during full dress. Usually embellished with Regimental Eagle Plate, plumes and chin straps of gold or metal.. Think of a West Point hat worn during parade. Still use the rope to tighten, this was down before hats were fitted to circumference of head. Guess this is a carry over from way back when.

Here is the Scottish 19th century SHAKO:




Here is inside of a SHAKO from 19th century, line/ribbon missing, but you can see the holes used to adjust cap to fit your own size head.



Guess its just a preference. THANKS...

[ThistleDown]

Yes, I do recall him saying that. And I suppose there will always be traditions within small groups. I was speaking more towards the greater beliefs that tied-vs-untied actually signifies something to everyone, and it doesn't. I do find it interesting, however, that Cluny ties his in a bow which seems to indicate that the MacPherson tradition is not universal.

I whole-heartedly agree with you, Tobus. Sometimes what one states is traditional is simply wishful thinking. A bit like "One hundred of those invited to our first gathering couldn't be with us, but the three of us who were there are sure that this will become an annual tradition".

[Katia]

I imagine some American men would consider a bow too feminine, some wouldn't want the hassle of keeping the thing tied (if not made that way permanently), and some had a bow when they started out this morning and it came untied somewhere along the way. (Me, I just don't like bows, and also like to think my ribbons flutter in the wind in a fun way. I'd say "also I think the band just leaves them down so I do too" but the band didn't seem to prescribe a whole lot, so if some people chose bows I doubt anyone would say anything and perhaps might not even notice. It was years before the PM noticed one piper's Balmoral was navy rather than black like everyone else's, as it was his personal Balmoral...)

(Or maybe it's just me who's terrible at keeping bows tied. My shoelaces can come undone even when double-knotted.)

[tweedhead]

I tried leaving the ribbons untied just one time, and the wind picked up a ribbon and flicked it around into the side of my eye. Now I leave them tied.

Another thing I've noticed but haven't seen talked about elsewhere: Robert Mackie diced balmorals with ribbons have a notch in the brim like so
IMG_2018-11-30_17-51-57.jpeg
Whoops, looks like it's loosened over the years and gotten a bit sloppy. I'll have to re-tie that. But they also sell what they call a flat bow, which is just a small decorative bow stitched onto a complete brim, no notch.
IMG_2018-11-30_17-51-38.jpeg
For some reason I've found it just about impossible to find pictures of the flat bow style anywhere. The notch gives the ribbon-equipped bonnets a little more give when worn, or when sewn together makes them a bit more secure. The flat bow diced brim doesn't have any play and has to be sized a little more carefully to ensure the fit is comfortable.

I find I like the flat bow more than the tied bow now. It's just smaller and simpler with a nice clean silhouette.

Out of idle curiosity: has anyone ever tried tying the ribbons in a different fashion than a plain bow, or have bonnets ever had more than two ribbons or different things like cords or strings?

[Tobus]

Another thing I've noticed but haven't seen talked about elsewhere: Robert Mackie diced balmorals with ribbons have a notch in the brim like so

Whoops, looks like it's loosened over the years and gotten a bit sloppy. I'll have to re-tie that. But they also sell what they call a flat bow, which is just a small decorative bow stitched onto a complete brim, no notch.

I wasn't aware that Mackie Balmorals had different styles of bows. Mine (non-diced) has the V-notch in the back, with ribbons stitched on either side of the gap. This is so the ribbons can be (must be?) tied into a bow to snug up the brim to the wearer's head. As you can see below, mine needed to be closed up all the way. So I whip-stitched the V-notch together permanently, tied the ribbons in a bow, and put a single stitch through the center of the bow so it can't come untied.

[Tobus]

On the other hand, some Balmorals (like this one from glengarryhats.com) have decorative/nonfunctional tails that cannot be tied in a bow. The way they are stitched on at the back does not draw the band to the wearer's head, and there is no notch for that purpose. They are stitched together below the bottom of the band, keeping them together for a bit, but then they separate and fly wildly in the wind. With this type, there is no choice but to wear them loose, short of cutting them off.

I couldn't say with any authority, but my guess is that this is not a traditional Scottish way of making a Balmoral, and is an example of a style that developed just for show, without the extra work of making the headband adjustable to the head. This one is made in Asia.

[Tobus]

Out of idle curiosity: has anyone ever tried tying the ribbons in a different fashion than a plain bow, or have bonnets ever had more than two ribbons or different things like cords or strings?

I do have a hand-knitted/felted Balmoral which was made with an inner set of narrow "drawstring" ribbons that go inside the bottom band (all the way around the head, I think). I have them tied in a knot to suit my head size with the long tails hanging, and they are underneath a wider set of decorative tails which are stitched to the back of the bonnet on either side of where the smaller ribbons exit the band. At this point in time, I have not chosen to tie the decorative tails into a bow, so I actually have 4 ribbons hanging back there. I haven't yet decided whether to do something different with them.

[Laird O'the Cowcaddens]

The Regimental TOS worn in Scottish Regiments have the flat sewn on ribbon. As mentioned previously, the modern TOS is issued in various sizes therefore no need for the pull-through ribbon. The British Beret still has the pull-through ribbon when issued by RQMS.

[Bruce Scott]

The Regimental TOS worn in Scottish Regiments have the flat sewn on ribbon. As mentioned previously, the modern TOS is issued in various sizes therefore no need for the pull-through ribbon. The British Beret still has the pull-through ribbon when issued by RQMS.

It does but they don't provide for much in the way of adjustment Just like the TOS, they also come in different sizes.