The joys and dangers of Ebay pipes

[OC Richard]

Oh no!!

I didn't know Kintail was using that stuff.

I know Hardie was, during that time. I was working at a Highland Outfitter in the 1980s who carried Hardie pipes, and Hardie was switching their imitation ivory every few years.

Seems that in the late 70s/early 80s Hardie was using a strange plastic that had a slightly greenish tinge.

Then they switched to that stuff your Kintails has, kind of a marbleized stuff.

We would get shipments of practice chanters and bagpipes from Hardie with broken mounts fairly often. What it was, what the marble effect used two different sorts of plastic, one was brittle, the other was soft, and the mounts tended to crack along the border between the two kinds of stuff. A contributing factor was the Hardie didn't wrap their products very well: they would just toss dozens of loose Blackwood practice chanters in a box and ship them off.

Despite that stuff being brittle, I know of 1980s pipes mounted in it that have been in regular use for over 30 years that haven't had anything crack.

I'm really sorry about those pipes! I thought I saw Schreger lines. Had I known Kintail had used that stuff I would have been on the lookout, but I've seen dozens and dozens of Kintail pipes over the years and I've never seen one with that stuff before.

Sadly Ebay sellers often don't know how to wrap bagpipes. The worst thing is when bagpipes are shipped in a pipe case, because the various parts rattle around inside.

The Kintails I bought on Ebay had a case, but I told the seller I didn't want it. I asked him to bubble-wrap each part separately and put them in an ordinary cardboard box.

BTW for drone reeds my Pipe Major is using Balance Tones in the tenors and an inverted EzeeDrone bass.

So far, I'm using original Kinnairds in the tenors and an inverted EzeeDrone bass.

[imrichmond]

I think a number of pipe makers were using that same "marbleized" imitation ivory in the 1970s and 80s. I can remember one of my students purchasing a brand new set of Kintails around 1976-77 that had the same imitation ivory. I also had for many years a long Naill ABW chanter that dated from about 1979 that had a sole and ferrule of the same material. It was, to my mind at least, a very attractive ivory substitute.

[OC Richard]

I've seen Grainger & Campbells made in the 80s with that stuff. But Kintail surprises me.

I have a couple old Kintail catalogues and they show a plain whitish stuff, not sure what it is.

My Kintails made in 1981 and a friend's full-imitation ivory Kintails made in 1988 both have Catalin, which most pipemakers (Highland pipes and uilleann pipes) had been using since the 1940s if not earlier.

That makes me wonder why a set of Kintails made between 81 and 88 would have that marblised stuff.

Kintail using it in the 1970s makes it doubly strange, like they had both Catalin and the marblised stuff to hand and made pipes out of both through the 70s and 80s.

R G Lawrie used two types of imitation ivory concurrently (Catalin which turned amber and other stuff that stayed white) giving us those two-tone vintage Lawries (both bagpipes and practice chanters).





Another odd thing was that Lawrie would mix real ivory and Catalin. It was common for Lawrie Catalin-mounted sets to have ivory bushes.

Here's the opposite, which I've only seen on this one set: silver & real ivory Lawries with Catalin bushes!



I see this guy at various California Highland Games and I've examined these pipes. They're gorgeous and strange altogether.

[imrichmond]

In the late 1970s and the 1980s, Kintail was also using a material they called "imitation horn", which may have been the same marbleized material but with darker, greyish colouring. I recall that this imitation horn became quite popular, as it was a significant departure from the usual orange catalin and white ivory or imitation mounts. I believe Kintail was the only maker using it in those days. Kintails with chalice top drones and imitation horn ferrules and mounts were particularly distinctive pipes and were easy to spot in bands. Oddly enough, I have seen very few of those sets come up for sale used. Indeed, I can recall seeing only one, on one of the Facebook groups a few months back. It sold quickly, as I recall.

[WalesLax]

I think a number of pipe makers were using that same "marbleized" imitation ivory in the 1970s and 80s. I can remember one of my students purchasing a brand new set of Kintails around 1976-77 that had the same imitation ivory. I also had for many years a long Naill ABW chanter that dated from about 1979 that had a sole and ferrule of the same material. It was, to my mind at least, a very attractive ivory substitute.

I agree - for an imitation ivory, this marbled material has a very nice look to it!

Rob

[WalesLax]

Not a bagpipe, but an interesting bagpipe related item for sale on eBay.

Rob

[OC Richard]

Yes, and only $10,000!

You can have my copy of Logans Tutor for a mere $9,000

Seems absurd to put such a high price on a book that's still in print.

It is cool when you pick up an old copy of a bagpipe music book and there's old handwritten tunes stuck in between the pages.

Back in the late 1970s I stumbled upon a musty old Scottish imports shop that was closing down and selling everything including all the displays, furniture, decor, etc.

For a few dollars I got a big box of new cane drone reeds (we still used them then), an old Lawrie practice chanter, an old Lawrie goose, various piping supplies, some framed pictures, and a pile of antique pipe music books.

One of the books had evidently been owned by an Irish speaker who had adapted a number of traditional Irish tunes to the Highland pipes (real Irish music, not Tin Pan Alley stuff) with the titles written in old Irish script. Another book had a number of arrangements from a US Army Pipe Band dated in the 1950s.

[OC Richard]

Lovely pre-WWII Lawries going very cheaply.

I'm a big Lawrie person, I've owned around a dozen Lawries from 1905 to the 1970s and all have been great pipes.

Lawrie was known to mix two different forms of plastic, Catalin which turns butterscotch and some other plastic that doesn't. This particular set is all mounted in the light-coloured plastic except for the bushes which are Catalin.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Pre-WWII-RG....c100010.m2109

Also super cheap are these Catalin-mounted Gillanders & McLeod set. I have a band-mate who plays a set just like this, they sound super.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Gillander-A...4AAOSwocRgfhLo

Here's a Piob Mhor (Blairgowrie) set with issues. Not only does it have that marbilised imitation ivory with loads of cracks, also the wood seems to have a number of cracks. (Not that cracks in the wood bother me that much, I used to play a c1860 set of Glens that had 17 cracks in the Bass Drone stock, all sealed with glue, no leaks.)

This set is stamped 488 which is Piob Mhor's code meaning April 1988.

I recently went down the Piob Mhor rabbit-hole, doing some reading, and exchanging emails with their main maker Michael Phee who made pipes for Piob Mhor from 1986 to 2008. He now has his own pipemaking firm in Australia.

https://www.ebay.com/itm/Scottish-Gr...QAAOSwxbJgeLMq

[imrichmond]

Yes, that is a lovely set of Gillanders & McLeod. On behalf of a bandmate, I purchased an identical set a few years ago from a seller in Germany. I personally have two sets of G & M pipes, both made in the mid to late 1970s. One is half catalin and nickel with full beaded combing and was purchased used about 7 years ago, the other, which I bought used in 1977 or 78 has ABW projecting mounts, stainless steel ferrules and catalin ring caps and bushes with the same flat combing as the ebay set. I'm a big fan of G & M pipes. I played the flat combed set in a top grade 1 band for a number of years.

[WalesLax]

Oh no!!

I'm really sorry about those pipes! I thought I saw Schreger lines. Had I known Kintail had used that stuff I would have been on the lookout, but I've seen dozens and dozens of Kintail pipes over the years and I've never seen one with that stuff before.

There is absolutely no reason to be sorry, though I appreciate the sentiment - three people thought those looked like ivory, the seller couldn’t explain more and the pictures he sent weren’t bad, and for $500, it was worth the gamble. My thought had always been, if that is ivory, this is a steal and I’ll play them for special events, and if they aren’t ivory, I have a new fantastic backup set of pipes! I may sell my poly Dunbar set now, because they have never “felt” right to me. It’s not the plastic, it’s probably me, but for some reason, that has always been the most “difficult” set of pipes I have owned or borrowed.

For what it’s worth, I am still playing on eBay, looking for interesting sets to buy and/or post here.

Rob