Scottish names vs. English or Irish

[macwilkin]

The original Stewart was Fitz Alan whose father was Fitz Walter. (I'm quoting this from memory so don't hold me to it.) I'll have to look when I get home to be sure I am correct.

Jim

The prefix "Fitz" is actually a Norman term for "son of" -- That is why you have many Irish surnames like Fitzgerald, Fitzpatrick, FitzWilliam, etc., because the Normans were "invited" to Ireland in 1169 and were soon assimilated into Irish society. The Anglo-Normans also moved to Scotland, and some of the most famous Scottish names -- Bruce, Hay, Grant, etc. are actually Norman in origin.

My clan loyalty is to the Cummings (originally spelled "Comyn"), who were Anglo-Normans from the border between Normandy and Flanders.

Cheers,

Todd

[davedove]

The prefix "Fitz" is actually a Norman term for "son of" -- That is why you have many Irish surnames like Fitzgerald, Fitzpatrick, FitzWilliam, etc., because the Normans were "invited" to Ireland in 1169 and were soon assimilated into Irish society. The Anglo-Normans also moved to Scotland, and some of the most famous Scottish names -- Bruce, Hay, Grant, etc. are actually Norman in origin.

My clan loyalty is to the Cummings (originally spelled "Comyn"), who were Anglo-Normans from the border between Normandy and Flanders.

Cheers,

Todd

It really makes you wonder about some people who so fiercely claim there heritage is from a certain country when you think about things like this. For instance, in Scottish history there is a lot of conflict between the Scottish and the English, both fiercely claiming their own heritage, when in fact both sides claim a lot of Norman bloodlines.

Personally, I am mainly English and German, with a handful of Scottish and Irish, maybe a sprinkling of Welsh and French. But the Scottish and English lines also have ties to France, Germany, and the Scandinavian countries. I guess that makes me a true American, or in other words, a mutt.

[bubba]

Take it back far enough and we can all claim African heritage. Humans have been fiddlefooted from the beginning.

[Archangel]

Take it back far enough and we can all claim African heritage. Humans have been fiddlefooted from the beginning.

Grandad said if you don't learn something new each day, you've wasted your day.
Learned a new word:

fid·dle-foot·ed (fdl-ftd) adj.

1. Excitable or nervous: fiddle-footed ponies.
2. Inclined to roam or wander.

[Kilts_Knave]

I think Stuart is the French spelling of Stewart, as penned by the french Mary Queen of Scots.

[Woodsheal]

"Fitz" actually means "illegitimate son of." A bastard son of a Norman king would gain the name "FitzRoy"....

[Kilts_Knave]

"Fitz" actually means "illegitimate son of."

http://www.question.com/dictionary/fitz.html

[macwilkin]

"Fitz" actually means "illegitimate son of." A bastard son of a Norman king would gain the name "FitzRoy"....

Thank you Woodsheal, for reminding me of this! The neurons weren't all firing this morning! ;)

T.

[MacSimoin]

"Fitz" actually means "illegitimate son of." A bastard son of a Norman king would gain the name "FitzRoy"....

The origins, meaning and usage of the prefix Fitz sparks debate even to this day. However, though no offense is intended, I feel the post quoted above is a presumptive and generalized statement. Allow me to clarify this: Regarding my own lengthy research into the etymology of the surnames of and place names in Ireland, I've come to find the earliest known use of Fitz (as part of a compound surname) was in the Roy (Roi, from France) family of England; they produced an illegitimate heir to the crown who eventually became known as Fils de Roi (Anglicized as Fitz Roy). The use of the French word fils (meaning son and not son of) in England was sometimes used afterwards to describe a "bastard son" (though this was not always the case).

The definition found in this posted link is a little closer to the truth:

http://www.question.com/dictionary/fitz.html

For those in Ireland (after the Norman invasions), “Fitz” is historically recognized as simply meaning “son of” (properly, illegitimacy is never inferred with any Irish patronym). The linguisitic inference of 'mc' in Ireland (to denote son of) can be traced back in Ireland to before the time of Christ (re, the Annals of Ireland, Annals of Ulster, Annals of Connacht and Annals of Loch Ce) though it was not used or attached as a prefix in any Irish patronym until after 1000 AD (surname use began here around this time).

[MacSimoin]

"Fitz" actually means "illegitimate son of." A bastard son of a Norman king would gain the name "FitzRoy"....

The origins, meaning and usage of the prefix Fitz sparks debate even to this day. However, though no offense is intended, I feel the post quoted above is a presumptive and generalized statement. Allow me to clarify this: Regarding my own lengthy research into the etymology of the surnames of and place names in Ireland, I've come to find the earliest known use of Fitz (as part of a compound surname) was in the Roy (Roi, from France) family of England; they produced an illegitimate heir to the crown who eventually became known as Fils de Roi (Anglicized as Fitz Roy). The use of the French word fils (meaning son and not son of) in England was sometimes used afterwards to describe a "bastard son" (though this was not always the case).

The definition found in this posted link is a little closer to the truth:

http://www.question.com/dictionary/fitz.html

For those in Ireland (after the Norman invasions), “Fitz” is historically recognized as simply meaning “son of” (properly, illegitimacy is never inferred with any Norman-Irish patronym). The linguisitic inference of 'mc' in Ireland (to denote son of) can be traced back in Ireland to before the time of Christ (re, the Annals of Ireland, Annals of Ulster, Annals of Connacht and Annals of Loch Ce) though it was not used or attached as a prefix in any Irish patronym until after 1000 AD (surname use began here around this time).

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