A question for our Irish kiltie brothers

[Graywolf]

Obviously in this day and age every group needs a symbol that is easily identifiable, that people connect to that group, and that stands out. For all Celts, this is the kilt. Whether Scots, Irish, Welsh, or Breton. As one of the largest, most dynamic, important and almost forgotten peoples in history - we Celts need an identifying symbol which can be used to distinguish us from others; to represent our heritage; and to unite us. That symbol is the kilt!!

[Troy]

Obviously in this day and age every group needs a symbol that is easily identifiable, that people connect to that group, and that stands out. For all Celts, this is the kilt. Whether Scots, Irish, Welsh, or Breton.

Without wanting to throw this thread off-topic by moving away from discussing the Irish connection with kilts, I would respectfully add the Cornish to this list.

Although there is evidence to suggest that there was a kilt-like garment worn in Cornwall in the early 16th Century (some figures carved into the ends of church pews in Altarnun), it would not be sensible suggest that there is an unbroken tradition of kilt wearing in Cornwall.

The year 1903 marked what could arguably be called the first 'modern' appearance of the Cornish kilt: at the Celtic Congress in that year, the Cornish delegate, a "wode-blue" kilt as a symbol of Cornwall's "Celticness". Other Cornishmen picked up on the idea began wearing kilts in solid black, which became recognised as the colour for Cornish kilts (in the same way that, for example, red is the Welsh colour).

Sixty years later, the Cornish bard, E E Morton-Nance registered the sett of the Cornish National tartan, the colours of which have great significance in Cornish history (I won't go into all that here - there is plenty of information available on this Worldy Widey Webby thing!).

"Cornish" kilts are becoming more and more common, both within Cornwall and amongst those of Cornish descent all over the world, and are seen as a symbol of Cornwall's "Celticness", and, indeed, its historical and cultural separateness from England.


Regards,

Troy

[Peter C.]

I lived in Scotland as a child and the only kilts I saw were worn by the local boy scout pipe band. I started wearing a kilt in a British military pipe band. I am English. I have worn my kilt and played my pipes at Burns night dinners and New Years eve parties with Scottish, Irish and English attending and I have often been the only one wearing a kilt. I was also one of the few who had no family claim to a tartan. THE SCOTTS DIDN`T MIND! In fact they loved it.

The USA has its own tartans, so has Canada. So why not Ireland? When a tartan is formed for a clan or region, kilts made from it become a sort of national dress.

I have never seen the Irish people living in England wearing kilts, unless they were in the military or a pipe band. Even when I was wearing my kilt, my Irish friends never mentioned Irish kilts. They would celebrate their culture by having a pint and a sing-song and exchanging tales with friends. But they were close to home.

When you are thousands of miles and possibly a few generations away from that culture, being able to wear some sort of national dress must make you feel closer to that culture. I think that is reason enough for the Irish to wear a kilt to celebrate their culture.

As I said before, the Scotts don`t mind, they love weaving the cloth and selling you the kilts.

I don`t know how you tell a Cornish man, as people have been moving to and from Cornwall for centuries. In fact if you check the DNA of anyone indiginous to the British Isles, you will probably find links to every country in the group, as they have been mingling for centuries.

Peter

[Troy]

I don`t know how you tell a Cornish man, as people have been moving to and from Cornwall for centuries. In fact if you check the DNA of anyone indiginous to the British Isles, you will probably find links to every country in the group, as they have been mingling for centuries.

Peter

Peter,
How do you tell a Cornish man what?

Seriously, though, I'm not quite sure what you mean here: are you suggesting that someone needs a certain DNA in order to lay claim to a cultural heritage? How do you tell if someone is a Welsh man? A Scottish man? A Breton woman? A Cornish man, I guess, is somebody who was born in and/or lives in Cornwall and/or has Cornish ancestry. Someone who identifies themself as being Cornish is no less Cornish than someone who identifies themself as Irish is Irish for similar reasons.

For centuries the Cornish had their own language, which unfortunately all but died out. The Cornish dialect, though, is still going strong (much like the dialects of other areas of the British Isles) and is even evident in the way I speak - 150 years and five generations away from my Cornish born ancestors. The reason for this is that the Cornish had their own traditions and customs which they took to all corners of the world, including the area in which I was born.

To say that there is no such thing as a Cornish identity, which I think is what you are suggesting, because there is no distinct "Cornish" DNA is completely irrelevant. Being Cornish is about relating to a distinct culture, just as being Irish, Welsh, Manx, Breton, Galician, Lithuanian, Polish etc. is.

For the record, I do not consider myself Cornish - I am an Australian who grew up in an area and a household with very obvious historical and cultural links to Cornwall. I also have Scots, Irish, English and German ancestry. (You are 100% correct when you say that people from all Celtic nations have been intermingling for centuries - nowhere is that more evident than in Australia, where people from everywhere have been intermingling for the last couple of centuries.)

I wear the kilt because it looks great, feels comfortable and because it acknowledges an ancestry which is is not "just" English (that is in no way a slur against England or the English).

I'm sorry to hijack this thread, but I just wanted to get that off my chest.

Regards,

Troy