The perfect kilt for daily wear?

[fluter]

You have just described

(a) an X-kilt, cut to high-rise
(b) a FK casual, your choice of pockets
or ??? I thought of a UK Mocker, but I don't know how it'd wear at high-rise.

Choose a fabric like poly-cotton twill, neutral colors like tan/gray/olive and you have your easy-care, go-with-everything kilt.

[Tartan Hiker]

Make an X-kilt as per Alan H's instructions, this will teach you the basic philosophy of contemporary kilt construction. Then order up some polyviscose material and strike out on your own to develop the garment that is your "perfect" kilt.

[creativeaccents]

I made one kilt wherein I incorporated my earlier thoughts only to discover that I really don't like the lowrider style at all for my physique. Even a hint of a "dun-lop", especially when combined with a larger rear (you just can't beat genes" throws the hip riders off both in the flow of how the kilt lies and in the length in the back. This is why I now far prefer the higher waist as in my Kidders, both the Black Watch and canvas.
My impression had been that the X-Kilt was for a front flap that didn't extend from hip to hip. Guess that could be adjusted considerably, but wouldn't the front panel require some vertical darts to span the front from the front of one hip to the other and still lie properly?

[fluter]

I made one kilt wherein I incorporated my earlier thoughts only to discover that I really don't like the lowrider style at all for my physique...

My impression had been that the X-Kilt was for a front flap that didn't extend from hip to hip. Guess that could be adjusted considerably, but wouldn't the front panel require some vertical darts to span the front from the front of one hip to the other and still lie properly?

Several X-kilts (see prototype #2) have been made with wider, more "trad" looking over-aprons. My first ended up as a low-rise, with the apron 10 inches at the top. The next will be high-rise, 12 inch apron and 9 box-pleats. Could go bigger, but I think that in my case the reduced number of pleats might not have enough "give."

I don't understand the question about darts. All of my kilts have aprons that are essentially flat (no tailoring), and my understanding is that that's normal.

[The Wizard of BC]

So can we assume by this thread that you are considering joining the ranks of manufacturers? We can always use more good kiltmakers. Especially if you can find a way to produce a high quality product at a reasonable price.

Before you jump in I suggest you get a copy of Barb Tewksbury's book "The Art of Kiltmaking". In it you will find the first rule of aprons - Never put darts in the aprons! The shaping is all in the apron edges.

[creativeaccents]

So can we assume by this thread that you are considering joining the ranks of manufacturers? We can always use more good kiltmakers. Especially if you can find a way to produce a high quality product at a reasonable price.

Before you jump in I suggest you get a copy of Barb Tewksbury's book "The Art of Kiltmaking". In it you will find the first rule of aprons - Never put darts in the aprons! The shaping is all in the apron edges.

So can we assume by this thread that you are considering joining the ranks of manufacturers? We can always use more good kiltmakers. Especially if you can find a way to produce a high quality product at a reasonable price.

Before you jump in I suggest you get a copy of Barb Tewksbury's book "The Art of Kiltmaking". In it you will find the first rule of aprons - Never put darts in the aprons! The shaping is all in the apron edges.

NO SIR! Not planning on venturing into manufacturing. My degree was in marketing and my career was in marketing (for clarification, marketing is FAR more than sales). I love marketing and this, plus my own wearing of kilts, making of kilts, and research of every possible style, design, and maker of kilts that I can find on the web, plus the observations on this fine board led me to consider where things are and what people love most and desire most in kilts.

I have found those ranging from those in the two digit prices to over 2000 and so many styles. As you well know, there are already fairly established buyer/market segments based upon the pricing and styles. Interestingly, the super expensive kilts are not the most complex, but, rather, fairly simple designs, so even for kilts the same marketing factors as with other "designer" products enters in. But, this is not the mainstream market any more than the very formal, tailored kilt is.

For that matter, I don't see the bottom end or entry level kilt as being the market of most promise when viewed on an international level any more than I do the more rugged waist hugger. Actually, I think there is a huge potential for what I have been ruminating on, a basic style with straight forward features for everyday wear that would enable a fine kilt to be taken easily into more applications with less resistance. I can see the day when a non Celtic kilt would be a part of a suited or even formal item of attire and the same design available in other fabrics for less formal occasions. This would require larger scale numbers for manufacture and broader availability.

For now I simply enjoy the reflection and sharing of ideas, as I work on my own distribution by MENSPLACE on eBAY as a step one towards developing greater world wide awareness and availability. Today, I distribute the Kidder line and within the next couple of weeks will be adding the Utilikilt line, both well made, high quality for their niche. In growing slowly, I have the time to learn and test the waters while already beginning the path toward international distribution.

Manufacturing is not in my plans, but marketing and distribution very much are, while also totally enjoying Barbara's book, making and wearing my own, and hearing other's thoughts, likes, dislikes and desires.

[The Wizard of BC]

For that matter, I don't see the bottom end or entry level kilt as being the market of most promise when viewed on an international level any more than I do the more rugged waist hugger. Actually, I think there is a huge potential for what I have been ruminating on, a basic style with straight forward features for everyday wear that would enable a fine kilt to be taken easily into more applications with less resistance. I can see the day when a non Celtic kilt would be a part of a suited or even formal item of attire and the same design available in other fabrics for less formal occasions. This would require larger scale numbers for manufacture and broader availability.

Thank you for those well written words. It is exactly that thinking that has driven me in the design and manufacture of FK's.

The last sentence is the kicker though. To manufacture on a larger scale I would need significant capitalization to sub-contract the manufacturing. With its associated loss of the personal touch.
The only way to bring the price into range of other garments would necessitate farming out manufacturing to an area with lower labor costs and purchasing fabrics by the container load. Again with the loss of personal contact.
Both of these options also negate the ability of custom work.

I like meeting my customers face to face. I also love to watch the look on their faces when they first put my kilts on.
I like to be able to fit a customer with exactly the kilt they want. One that fits perfectly and has the features they need.
I also like doing some of the work myself.
I straddle the line everyday between taking my business to the next level of marketing and getting bigger than I am to sell a higher number of kilts, and growing slowly knowing that some customers will have to wait in line for the perfect kilt.
I fully expect that one day I will find myself spending my entire day managing a company and not having the time to sit at a machine. Then having a customer read his hang tag and finding "Your kilt was sewn by Steve" on it.
I also fully expect that some day, some hard driving young person will take what I have started, take it mainstream and put me out of business.

Until that time I satisfy myself with the analogy that I am not buying a ship load of Yugos and selling them out of a warehouse, nor am I building a Bentley and selling them only to those who are buying the prestige.

There is something in knowing that every potential customer can call me on the phone and describe his perfect kilt and that soon he will strap it on and walk down the street with pride.

[The Wizard of BC]

Thank you Fluter for the endorsement.

Now my thoughts. It would seem that what you are describing is a Freedom Kilt more than anything else. The ideas you have presented are what I attempt to do with each kilt I make.

You didn't mention how wide you want your pleats. The reason I bring that up is that if you want to use Cargo style pockets you are limiting your self to wide pleats. Cargo pockets just don't seem to appeal to many people when paired with 1" pleats. In addition, a combination of cargo pockets and wide pleats will create less swish than narrower, clean pleats.

Then I disagree with your wanting exclusively Cargo style pockets because you think other styles will create bulges. Not true. If designed properly. I offer my Rear Welt & Side Slash Pockets as examples. Ask those here who own them and you will find just the opposite. I routinely ask customers to find the 2 1/2" thick wallet in my Rear Welt Pockets and they can't see it. I then begin to unload my Side Slash Pockets. Their eyes start to bulge when out come my pipe, tobacco pouch, coin purse, lighter, a ring of 20 keys, and a cell phone. There had been no noticeable bulging of the aprons even when leaded like that. The problem is that you can't just slap on a pocket have it look well when loaded. It must be designed as if it's loaded already.

Now to apron width. You specify a full width, hip to hip, apron. Then you are not going to be able to use side cargo pockets at all. The pockets will end up being placed well behind the centerline of your leg and will feel awkward and will not be used. You will also end up sitting on them all the time.

Now fasteners. The two second rule you stipulate rules out straps & buckles. You're now left with snaps, hooks & eyes, or velcro. Each of these options is, in order, less secure. I don't mention buttons because your hypothetical design seems to imply you desire adjustability. Why? Other than a kilt, when was the last time you bought a man's piece of clothing that was adjustable? Blue Jeans certainly aren't.
(Op-Ed)I personally like taking a few moments when I get dressed. The "wrap & run" thinking seems to be a N. American trait.

You also don't mention fabrics. You imply a washing machine capable fabric with minimum wrinkling. That leaves Polyester and Polyester blended fabrics. Unless of course you don't mind wrinkles, curling of the pleats, and staining.
No color goes with everything and is suitable for any occasion. Black is the most universal but shows dirt.

I didn't intend this to come out as an advertisement for FK but it seems you are describing what I have been advocating for the last 4 1/2 years. My Company tag line is "Custom Contemporary Kilts for Everyday Wear".
And unless you are prepared to mass produce a line of kilts, some with wide pleats, some with narrow, some with different fasteners, and with every different pocket placement that will suit every single customer's taste I think you are doing custom work. So that eliminates your hypothetical kilt to the price point of a pair of jeans.

Good luck in your search. The only thing I know of today that seems to me to fit your criteria perfectly is the bath towel that is printed with a sporran.

The next best actual kilt is my Industrial Model Kilt with the two adjustable snaps on the waistband. Wide Pleats, Detachable Cargo Pockets, and minimum custom tailoring.

[creativeaccents]

Steve,

Thanks for all of the many good points. Your kilts are indeed excellent. In fact, in considering so many of your points, I consider your formal kilt with two side slash pockets to be very close indeed. I could imagine that in a wide range of fabrics so that it would certainly be the equal of others I have seen at 2000.00 on other "fashion" kilt sites.

I'm still pondering the leather straps though as I would question their use in a more formal business environment. That is NOT a shot, but a simple point of consideration. The formal has the smooth lines, nice contemporary look, and "flow" that would look good in formal tweeds and pin stripes or single colors as well as in less formal fabrics...a simple, classic look without being too (howls of protest here) Celtic, for a far broader, international market.

You have bought out many great points for further consideration. Thank You!

[ccga3359]

What was not mentioned was FK's beer gut cut. Extra measurements are taken for the dip in the aprons. Still I prefer to wear my FK at the navel. Doing this with wearing my kilt at my expanding waistgives me space behind the aprons for what ever is in my front pockets. Of my FK I use those pockets the most, in fact I prefer to have these pockets on all my kilts casual or traditional. I use my side cargo pockets fairly frequently as I don't wear the sporran with this kilt. Same goes for my RKilts although I tend to use the incorperated beer holder straps (tool holder? My foot) just as much. the rear pockets on my FK (not cargo as I didn't want to take away from the look of the pleats) is the least seldom used pockets. My next FK I will most definately get the front slash pocket but will probably opt out of the side and rear pockets and grab a sporran instead. At times I prefer the look of a sporran but would daren't wear it with all the pockets.