Clan badges vs family crests??

[Sean_the_Kilted]

Continuing to play devils advocate, does any design with a shield fall under the Lord Lyon? If Sport Kilt or USA Kilts, both of which have shield logos, were Scottish companies, would they worry about being prosecuted if they didn't register? What if I designed a coat of arms with a shield with obviously nontraditional elements such as 3 smiley faces or photos of all my immediate family? On the other side of things, what the design and ancestry rules of people who actually apply to register arms? Can someone who emigrated from China and is now a UK citizen, apply for a coat of arms? If so, can they use non traditional elements such as Chinese dragons or have the motto in Chinese characters?

[macwilkin]

If so, can they use non traditional elements such as Chinese dragons or have the motto in Chinese characters?

I can't speak to using traditional Chinese symbols, but there is a prescedent for using First Nations symbols in Canadian heraldry, as this web page shows:

http://www.geocities.com/vsredmond/AH/I-Iarms.html

Regards,

Todd

[Sketraw]

Continuing to play devils advocate, does any design with a shield fall under the Lord Lyon? If Sport Kilt or USA Kilts, both of which have shield logos, were Scottish companies, would they worry about being prosecuted if they didn't register?

Sean, If the shield being used looked like an heraldic device yes, however Sport Kilt doesnt. 1. It has a name 'Sport Kilt' on it. 2. The Lion faces the wrong way. It all depend how Lord Lyon sees it. I would suggest if you want to learn more buy the book 'Simply Heraldry'. Coats of arms and their charges and construction, tincitures and metals (colours) is a more complex than you would imagine.

What if I designed a coat of arms with a shield with obviously nontraditional elements such as 3 smiley faces or photos of all my immediate family?

Do you think that would be heraldic?

On the other side of things, what the design and ancestry rules of people who actually apply to register arms? Can someone who emigrated from China and is now a UK citizen, apply for a coat of arms? If so, can they use non traditional elements such as Chinese dragons or have the motto in Chinese characters?

Yes, a person from China who is now a UK Subject could petition for a Coat of Arms to either the Court of the Lord Lyon, Scotland or the College of Arms England. There are many COA with Chinese Dragons, Japanese Lotus Leafs, US bison, Bald Headed Eagles etc etc etc.

Agin if your interested in COA and heraldry take a look around some of the websites such as the American Heraldry Society, The Heraldry Society of Scotland, The Heraldry Society (England) and loads more. What is known as the 'Science of Heraldry' and the 'Laws of Heraldry' has evolved for over 800 years, with various countries having various rules and regulations regarding it and some with no rules at all.

[MacMillan of Rathdown]

If it can be blazoned, then it's heraldry. Although in the instance of the three smiley faces I would think this would come to the attention of the Master of Lunacy loooooong before Lyon would ever deal with it.

[gilmore]

Continuing to play devils advocate, does any design with a shield fall under the Lord Lyon? If Sport Kilt or USA Kilts, both of which have shield logos, were Scottish companies, would they worry about being prosecuted if they didn't register? What if I designed a coat of arms with a shield with obviously nontraditional elements such as 3 smiley faces or photos of all my immediate family? On the other side of things, what the design and ancestry rules of people who actually apply to register arms? Can someone who emigrated from China and is now a UK citizen, apply for a coat of arms? If so, can they use non traditional elements such as Chinese dragons or have the motto in Chinese characters?

Most of your questions are answered authoritatively here http://www.lyon-court.com/lordlyon/221.185.html at Lord Lyon's website.

[BoldHighlander]

Hi Terry, No to 'Clan MacX' because they are not the Arms of Clan MacX. It is not the clan which own the arms but the Chief. Keep remembering arms are personal property of one person (Scotland, England & Southern Ireland that is) apart from those granted to organisations.

Thanks for explaining this to me John, I greatly appreciate it & more fully understand.

I find the subject interesting & need to check out the book you all have recommended.