The Clearances

[macwilkin]

Not necessarily true. Most historians believe that many scots and scots-irish did rebel and actually made up as much as 40% of the continental army. They came to america originally seeking freedoms not allowed them in their homelands-----namely land availability to farm and religious freedom (calvinists vs british Anglican) not the least. They may not have been the actual instigators fomenting dissent and rebellion---those were the wealthy english-derived landed gentry looking after their own businesses and lifestyles, but the supporting populace and backbone of the actual army was in large part scots or scots irish.

Sources, please?

You are confusing two distinct groups -- Highlanders and Ulster-Scots. The former were mostly Episcopalian or Roman Catholic in religion, the latter Presbyterian. The two groups had very little in common, and the Highlanders did not share the Ulster-Scots' revolutionary zeal. Also, Most Highlanders had no notion of republicanism that the Ulster-Scots embraced.

Sure, some Highlanders did embrace the cause, Hugh Mercer, for example, an ex-Jacobite, but most remained neutral or did fight for the crown.

You are quite correct that the Ulster-Scots did make up a huge part of the rebel forces -- one MP said, "Cousin America has run off with a Presbyterian parson, and there is nothing we can do about it". But I'm afraid I cannot agree with your claim that Highland Scots overwhelmingly embraced the rebellion.

You might wish to take a look at Duane Meyer's The Highland Scots of North Carolina, one of the best studies of Highland immigration out there.

Again, I'd love to see your sources.

Regards,

Todd

[James MacMillan]

Sources, please?

You are confusing two distinct groups -- Highlanders and Ulster-Scots. The former were mostly Episcopalian or Roman Catholic in religion, the latter Presbyterian. The two groups had very little in common, and the Highlanders did not share the Ulster-Scots' revolutionary zeal. Also, Most Highlanders had no notion of republicanism that the Ulster-Scots embraced.

Sure, some Highlanders did embrace the cause, Hugh Mercer, for example, an ex-Jacobite, but most remained neutral or did fight for the crown.

You are quite correct that the Ulster-Scots did make up a huge part of the rebel forces -- one MP said, "Cousin America has run off with a Presbyterian parson, and there is nothing we can do about it". But I'm afraid I cannot agree with your claim that Highland Scots overwhelmingly embraced the rebellion.

You might wish to take a look at Duane Meyer's The Highland Scots of North Carolina, one of the best studies of Highland immigration out there.

Again, I'd love to see your sources.

Regards,

Todd

Sources, please?

[macwilkin]

Sources, please?

Hunter, James. A Dance Called America: the Scottish Highlands, the United States, and Canada. Edinburgh: Mainstream, 1995.

Meyer, Duane. The Highland Scots of North Carolina, 1732-1776. Chapel Hill: U. of NC Press, 1961, 1987.

Moore, Christopher. The Loyalists: revolution, exile and settlement. Toronto : McClelland & Stewart, 1994.

Ray, Celeste. Highland Heritage: Scottish Americans in the American South. Chapel Hill: U. of NC Press, 2001.

Szasz, Fernec M. Scots in the North American West, 1790-1917. Norman: U. of Oklahoma Press, 2000.

Toffey, John J. A woman nobly planned : fact and myth in the legacy of Flora MacDonald. Durham, N.C. : Carolina Academic Press, c1997.

[macwilkin]

One more:

Leyburn, James G. The Scotch-Irish: a social history. Chapel Hill, University of North Carolina Press, 1962, 1989.

T.

[JS Sanders]

It's fascinating how the original question I posed two days ago has evolved into its present condition.

One of cajunscot's sources, Celeste Ray's Highland Heritage: Scottish Americans in the American South is worth noting. I read this a coupla years ago and would strongly suggest the same for anyone with even a passing interest. It's more of a textbook, but not narcoleptic. Though her research was centered on South'ners, there's much overlap to other Scotophiles in the US.

Prof Ray's a professor of anthropology at the University of the South and writes of "the phenomenal growth of the Scottish heritage movement across the US".

She notes that the movement is dominated by "highlandism," a phenomenon she defines as ScotoAmericans, regardless of their ancestral regional origins (Lowland, Highland, Ulster Scots), "claim a Highland Scots identity constructed in the 19th century through romanticism, militarism, & tourism."

Highland Heritage is another eye-opening book much like John Prebble's The Highland Clearances and James Hunter's A Dance Called America. Highly recommended.

A sidenote.... I bought James Hunter's book, Glencoe and the Indians, but haven't made time to read it yet.

Slainte yall,
steve

[macwilkin]

It's fascinating how the original question I posed two days ago has evolved into its present condition.

One of cajunscot's sources, Celeste Ray's Highland Heritage: Scottish Americans in the American South is worth noting. I read this a coupla years ago and would strongly suggest the same for anyone with even a passing interest. It's more of a textbook, but not narcoleptic. Though her research was centered on South'ners, there's much overlap to other Scotophiles in the US.

Prof Ray's a professor of anthropology at the University of the South and writes of "the phenomenal growth of the Scottish heritage movement across the US".

She notes that the movement is dominated by "highlandism," a phenomenon she defines as ScotoAmericans, regardless of their ancestral regional origins (Lowland, Highland, Ulster Scots), "claim a Highland Scots identity constructed in the 19th century through romanticism, militarism, & tourism."

Highland Heritage is another eye-opening book much like John Prebble's The Highland Clearances and James Hunter's A Dance Called America. Highly recommended.

A sidenote.... I bought James Hunter's book, Glencoe and the Indians, but haven't made time to read it yet.

Slainte yall,
steve

Glencoe & the Indians was released on this side of the pond by the Montana State Historical Society as Scottish Highlanders, Indian Peoples (Warning! Here be spoliers!):

http://mhs.mt.gov/pub/press/scothigh.asp

Ray's book is an eye-opener, INMHO. Once you read it, you will never look at a highland games the same way again. I saw some very striking parallels to Civil War reenacting when I read it.

Regards,

Todd

[sharpdressedscot]

Once you read it, you will never look at a highland games the same way again.

In a good way or bad??

[James MacMillan]

Hunter, James. A Dance Called America: the Scottish Highlands, the United States, and Canada. Edinburgh: Mainstream, 1995.

Meyer, Duane. The Highland Scots of North Carolina, 1732-1776. Chapel Hill: U. of NC Press, 1961, 1987.

Moore, Christopher. The Loyalists: revolution, exile and settlement. Toronto : McClelland & Stewart, 1994.

Ray, Celeste. Highland Heritage: Scottish Americans in the American South. Chapel Hill: U. of NC Press, 2001.

Szasz, Fernec M. Scots in the North American West, 1790-1917. Norman: U. of Oklahoma Press, 2000.

Toffey, John J. A woman nobly planned : fact and myth in the legacy of Flora MacDonald. Durham, N.C. : Carolina Academic Press, c1997.

Thanks, I now have a couple of new ones to read.

[Nick the DSM]

cool! looks like i have to go to the library soon.

[Coemgen]

A curriculum of California State History is essentially non-existent in California high schools. See, it's not on the State Exit Exams, so teachers are thoroughly discouraged from teaching it. I could rant on that, but will refrain. Suffice it to say that there's not a single kid in California that has to drive more than 75 miles to find SOMETHING fascinating from the 250 years (only 250 years!) of recorded human history in California, and yet I bet that the overwhelming majority have never been to a Mission, or a Gold Rush town, or Fort Ross.

I know! As I stated above, when I started public school as a high school freshman, I was astounded and shocked by my peers wilful ignorance of anything that was beyond what they needed to do to pass the classes. It's a real shame.

My parents and grandparents, in their great wisdom, took me and my brother and sister to museums and the missions and would take us to all sorts of neat places (the Stanford Theatre was always a favourite of mine before we moved to So. Cal. - I remember watching a series of Alfred Hitchcock films there - *sigh* those were the days). They'd also take us to the library, where I would spend hours (and still do!).