A highland scots pistol ???

[puffer]

In the " "Tartans & Heraldry" section - "Very Early Tartan Suit", This picture was posted


I found it very interesting, because it showed a "Highland Scots" pistol being carried by an individual poss. in FRANCE. ( NOTE - The Highland Scots pistol is an area of GREAT interest to me. The pistol seems to be, as Woodsheal posted, "The "scroll butt" type steel pistol (or "dag") was popular from ca. 1690-1740, most famously made by the Caddells, and Campbells, of Doune. Here's a pic of an original:"

BUT there was another picture posted, that was supposed to be of the same person.

I do not know which was the original, but the second picture
, IMHO has some problems as to "accuracy" ( NOTE, as you know, using paintings to est. Historical "facts" is often "problematical" do to "Artistic License")
Here are my thoughts.
1 The hand position, is not only VERY unnatural, but VERY dificult to achieve (IMHO)
2. The "BUTT" of the pistol is not one I have ever seen on a pistol from this late date (1771) it "appears (to me) to reflect an earlier style (mid 1600-very early 1700s) because of the angle of the "butt" here an example


PUFFER

[Finn]

I've seen reproduction pistols at historic reenactments for the Seven Years War. In fact, my old (& future) unit had one for public display. The steel pistol is commonly called "Scots" or "Scottish" over here.
If you're interested an owning one, I can link you to some places that may have them or can direct you.

[Nighthawk]

I don't know about the accuracy of the pistol- firearms are not my specialty- but I have a friend who has a Civil War era musket that he uses for hunting. One thing that we as reenactors some times forget is that "accuracy" is in itself a daunting thing. These were, to them, clothes, while to us, they are costume. In order to illustrate this fact and remind myself of it, I bought a 1600's era english doublet that I frequently wear with my ancient kilt. Why? Because it's warm and stylish. We have to remember that what the Scots wore were not uniform and regimented. They, like us, wore what they had on hand. 200 years from now, when there is a Metalheads of the Year 200 Reenactment Society, they will probably argue over what was most appropriate as footwear- Doc Martin's or Keds, or what have you. The truth is, it's ALL correct. I wear a kilt with my Slayer t shirts! So when considering the accuracy of the outfitting in any painting or reenactment situation, this is something we need to not loose sight of.

Just my own personal philosophy for whatever it's worth!

[Nighthawk]

I've seen reproduction pistols at historic reenactments for the Seven Years War. In fact, my old (& future) unit had one for public display. The steel pistol is commonly called "Scots" or "Scottish" over here.
If you're interested an owning one, I can link you to some places that may have them or can direct you.

I don't know about Puffer, but I would be very interested!!

[Finn]

I PM'ed you.

[Woodsheal]

Repros available here:
http://www.middlesexvillagetrading.com/NEWpistol.shtml

Getting back to Puffer's point, I think the portrait artist simply was inexpert in rendering the pistol in its proper configuration and proportions, but that what is depicted is in fact a typical Doune-style Scots 'dag' of the early 1700's.

Many painters of that period (and most others) were simply not experts on weaponry, and you often see oddly distorted guns and swords depicted. Then again, many are painted with precise exactness! It varies from artist to artist....

[puffer]

Repros available here:
http://www.middlesexvillagetrading.com/NEWpistol.shtml

Getting back to Puffer's point, I think the portrait artist simply was inexpert in rendering the pistol in its proper configuration and proportions, but that what is depicted is in fact a typical Doune-style Scots 'dag' of the early 1700's.

Many painters of that period (and most others) were simply not experts on weaponry, and you often see oddly distorted guns and swords depicted. Then again, many are painted with precise exactness! It varies from artist to artist....

Good insight

Puffer

[puffer]

I've seen reproduction pistols at historic reenactments for the Seven Years War. In fact, my old (& future) unit had one for public display. The steel pistol is commonly called "Scots" or "Scottish" over here.
If you're interested an owning one, I can link you to some places that may have them or can direct you.

I use the "term" "Highland Scots Pistol" because the ones in ths genre are unique. Remember, the "highlanders" were distnct from the majority of Scots ( "lowlanders") as were their pstols. The "lowland Scots also made & carried pistols, but they were mostly "English" in design ( + they also carried a few French)

Puffer

[puffer]

I don't know about the accuracy of the pistol- firearms are not my specialty- but I have a friend who has a Civil War era musket that he uses for hunting. One thing that we as reenactors some times forget is that "accuracy" is in itself a daunting thing. These were, to them, clothes, while to us, they are costume. In order to illustrate this fact and remind myself of it, I bought a 1600's era english doublet that I frequently wear with my ancient kilt. Why? Because it's warm and stylish. We have to remember that what the Scots wore were not uniform and regimented. They, like us, wore what they had on hand. 200 years from now, when there is a Metalheads of the Year 200 Reenactment Society, they will probably argue over what was most appropriate as footwear- Doc Martin's or Keds, or what have you. The truth is, it's ALL correct. I wear a kilt with my Slayer t shirts! So when considering the accuracy of the outfitting in any painting or reenactment situation, this is something we need to not loose sight of. Just my own personal philosophy for whatever it's worth!

VERY GOOD INSIGHT

I am VERY active in the "Traditional" Black Powder/Muzzle Loading. ( research, & historical presentations ( 1800-1840 ) I also shoot ML/BP compition ( mil. firearms iclude a "custom "Baker" & a Pedercolli "BESS") + I am a moderator on an Inernational forum http://www.traditionalmuzzleloadinga...ion.com/forum/

Again, I AGREE with you

Puffer

[puffer]

Here is a picture of one of my pistols. ( from Middlesexvillage)


The ones in this $$$ catagory are all made in INDIA. I you are going to shoot yours, with "live Ammo" ( powder, patch & ball) Then this is the source I would pick

Puffer