Armigerous Clans

[Highland Logan]

This is why Lord Lyon has raised the bar, and clearly set forth the requirements that need to be met if one is to be recognized as a chief. Hopefully the wide dissemination of these requirements will at last bury these two-bit con men somewhere in potters field with the word FRAUD carved on their tombstone.

Hear, Hear!

Frank

[gilmore]

...Even with such controls in place the occasional fraud does slip through the cracks-- a good case in point is that of the self-styled "McCarthy Mor", a fraudster who managed, over a ten year period, to produce dozens of forged documents to shore up his claim. It should be pointed out that these forgeries were extremely well crafted. They were done, apparently, by his partner, a Mr. Davidson, who was a well-trained and highly skilled restorer of antique documents.

....

Whatever happened to them? Were they ever charged and/or convicted of any crimes? Did any of their victims sue and were awarded damages? Are they living in obscure retirement somewhere?

[cessna152towser]

MacMillan of Rathdown wrote:-
Quote:
Originally Posted by cessna152towser
Article on armigerous clans on wiki here:-
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armigerous_clan

Well, the above quote from wikipedia is just garbage

Well if you think you know better why don't you try re-writing it?
The reality of the matter is that much of the truth of Scottish heritage has been lost in myth. Yes some of the Mac..... clans still have an active structure here in Scotland but most clans either had no formal organisations or had clan structures which lapsed and were later revived by well intentioned people of Scottish descent, with differing views as to the true history and this is why there is so much conflicting information out there, not only in wikipedia but in various so-called authoritative textbooks. The one I have in front of me is a beautiful book, entitled Scotland and her Tartans by Alexander Fulton. It is subtitled The Romantic Heritage of the Scottish Clans and Families. Romantic, exactly sums it up, many of the statements in it which are presented as facts can be no more than speculation.
We could argue for weeks over this, we native Scots, and our ex-patriate cousins hold differing interpretations of our clan history, all based on what we have read and have been told, but much of the truth is lost in history and been replaced by supposition.
Having been born and brought up in Scotland it never fails to amaze me that the people who claim to know most about the Scottish clan structure were invariably born overseas and are only partially of Scottish descent, and I hasten to add this is not a personal or specific criticism of anyone here, I have also experienced it within my own clan society. I only know what I was taught at school and what I have read since then and I know much of it is romance and myth. I did not go looking for a wikipedia article about armigerous clans just for the fun of adding something to this thread, rather I recalled this article had previously been cited to me by an American as his authority for insisting that my clan was an armigerous one.
What is fact, as has been said already, is that only the Lord Lyon can now recognise a Scottish clan chief. There are plenty of clans out there who are really clan societies set up with the approval of the Lord Lyon, some of whom might call their leader chief, but that does not make him a recognised clan chief here in Scotland. Approval means just that, and has no legal weight, nor does it grant exclusive right to use the family name, there is nothing to stop another group coming along and setting up another similar society, with or without first asking for the Lord Lyon's approval.
Can't we just enjoy the romance and myth of our shared clan heritage without trying to tell others that we think our version of history is the most authentic?

[Highland Logan]

Whatever happened to them? Were they ever charged and/or convicted of any crimes? Did any of their victims sue and were awarded damages? Are they living in obscure retirement somewhere?

Some are still floating under the radar, and even closer than one might think.

Frank

[Tattoo Bradley]

Do not underestimate the radar.

[Phil]

Having been born and brought up in Scotland it never fails to amaze me that the people who claim to know most about the Scottish clan structure were invariably born overseas and are only partially of Scottish descent, and I hasten to add this is not a personal or specific criticism of anyone here, I have also experienced it within my own clan society. I only know what I was taught at school and what I have read since then and I know much of it is romance and myth.

You've noticed it too, Alex. Somewhere along the line our heritage that we grew up with and live with every day has been hijacked to feed some vicarious need for a romantic story about noble kilted warriors bestriding the purple heather in the glens of an imagined homeland. I have to admit to an almost total ignorance of clans, mainly because they have been a complete and utter irrelevance during my lifetime apart from having been in the Lennox House at school and knowing that the local council buildings had once been the Buchanan Retreat. It is intriguing, therefore, to find people so obsessed with clans and talking about them as if they actually still existed when in reality they are in the main foreign organisations that purport to perpetuate this romantic myth nowadays.

[gilmore]

Some are still floating under the radar, and even closer than one might think.

Frank

I was, and am, curious about those two fellows in particular, the faux "McCarthy Mor" and his accomplice, Mr Davidson, and what ever became of them. They acheived so much notoriety in heraldry and genealogical circles that I wouldn't think they could lay low for long.

[MacMillan of Rathdown]

MacMillan of Rathdown wrote:-
Quote:
Originally Posted by cessna152towser
Article on armigerous clans on wiki here:-
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Armigerous_clan

Well, the above quote from wikipedia is just garbage

Well if you think you know better why don't you try re-writing it?

I don't have to. George Way of Plean and Romilly Squire have done an excellent job in their book The Scottish Clan and Family Encyclopedia. Mark Dennis, Charles Burnett, Sir Malcolm Innes, and a host of others have also written authoritatively on the subject. For those who rely on wikipedia as their source of information, I'd refer them to the title of this posting.

[MacMillan of Rathdown]

I was, and am, curious about those two fellows in particular, the faux "McCarthy Mor" and his accomplice, Mr Davidson, and what ever became of them. They acheived so much notoriety in heraldry and genealogical circles that I wouldn't think they could lay low for long.

Mr. Davidson will quite possibly "lay low" for a very long time. A convicted blackmailer, he is alleged to have died in Tangier several years ago. Mr. McCarthy, the faux "McCarthy Mor", still resides in that city.

[gilmore]

Mr. Davidson will quite possibly "lay low" for a very long time. A convicted blackmailer, he is alleged to have died in Tangier several years ago. Mr. McCarthy, the faux "McCarthy Mor", still resides in that city.

Sounds like a Tennessee Williams play: an aging confidence man, living out his declining years in exile in a colorful, yet unfashionable, locale.