Historic Painting Thread

[Nick the DSM]

Is it me or do three of the kilted people have pleats in the front??

[Chas]

I wonder how accurate these paintings are? As the saying goes - The spirit of the law or the letter of the law. Has the artist captured the impression of the sitter or are we looking at as near as dammit photographs. I don't believe it is the latter, so we must question how much of what we are seeing is accurate and how much is artistic license.

My Grandfather was a studio photographer in India at the turn of the last century. My cousin still has all the costume jewelery that the ladies were adorned with. In black and white pictures, you can't tell whether the pearls are real or not. There was always a Black-a-moor servant boy standing behind holding the cane or parasol (imported by my grandfather from Madagascar) and a couple of wolfhounds sitting at the subjects feet (family pets). All in all the people in the photos looked like kings and queens and not the clerks and shopkeepers that they were.

I think we can be a bit skeptical.

Regards

Chas

[macwilkin]

I wonder how accurate these paintings are? As the saying goes - The spirit of the law or the letter of the law. Has the artist captured the impression of the sitter or are we looking at as near as dammit photographs. I don't believe it is the latter, so we must question how much of what we are seeing is accurate and how much is artistic license.

My Grandfather was a studio photographer in India at the turn of the last century. My cousin still has all the costume jewelery that the ladies were adorned with. In black and white pictures, you can't tell whether the pearls are real or not. There was always a Black-a-moor servant boy standing behind holding the cane or parasol (imported by my grandfather from Madagascar) and a couple of wolfhounds sitting at the subjects feet (family pets). All in all the people in the photos looked like kings and queens and not the clerks and shopkeepers that they were.

I think we can be a bit skeptical.

Regards

Chas

I don't think the author of this thread was suggesting we accept these paintings carte blanche, Chas. I think we can all agree that paintings (or even photographs) capture just one aspect of life in general and how people might have dressed at a certain time in history.

Reenactors and living historians of later periods certainly depend on photographs, but also combine them with written documents -- although who of us thinks to document exactly what they are wearing every day down to what material the clothes were made of?

For example, numerous photos from the American Civil War in 1861 show soldiers on both sides armed to the teeth with pistols, bowie knives, swords, etc. -- we know from some contemporary journals that a majority of these were photographer's props, and those that were not were quickly thrown away on the route of march for being too much weight -- so in that regard, the photo does give a misleading impression that all soldiers carried pistols or Bowie knives.

Regards,

Todd

[Chas]

I don't think the author of this thread was suggesting we accept these paintings carte blanche, Chas. I think we can all agree that paintings (or even photographs) capture just one aspect of life in general and how people might have dressed at a certain time in history.

Reenactors and living historians of later periods certainly depend on photographs, but also combine them with written documents -- although who of us thinks to document exactly what they are wearing every day down to what material the clothes were made of?

For example, numerous photos from the American Civil War in 1861 show soldiers on both sides armed to the teeth with pistols, bowie knives, swords, etc. -- we know from some contemporary journals that a majority of these were photographer's props, and those that were not were quickly thrown away on the route of march for being too much weight -- so in that regard, the photo does give a misleading impression that all soldiers carried pistols or Bowie knives.

Regards,

Todd

I agree 100% Todd. All I am saying is that the paintings have a certain style - they are romantic, easy on the eye, we like looking at them. And as such they seduce us into a false sense of what is accurate and what is not. Personally, I wish that I had good copies, larger than A4. We have a hallway that is crying out for them to be framed and mounted there.

Regards
Chas

[Bigkahuna]

I hate to bring this up, but in the interest of historical accuracy I was wondering if some of these paintings were reversed. All the pipers seem to be left handed and one wears his cockade on the right side of his bonnet.

[thistlelass]

Is it me or do three of the kilted people have pleats in the front??

Of all the paintings shown, I counted six of those as having pleated front kilts...there could have been more than that, but I counted six! Something is amiss!!

[Woodsheal]

Of all the paintings shown, I counted six of those as having pleated front kilts...there could have been more than that, but I counted six! Something is amiss!!

Nope. The earliest kilts (pre-1780, roughly) were generally pleated around the entire circumference.

The vast majority of the paintings I would rate as highly accurate depictions, based upon the careful renderings of certain details: ex. sword hilts, pistols, and the like....

[sirdaniel1975]

I hate to bring this up, but in the interest of historical accuracy I was wondering if some of these paintings were reversed. All the pipers seem to be left handed and one wears his cockade on the right side of his bonnet.

As far as I know non of the paintings are reversed and there really isn't a rule suggesting how to wear the broad bonnet. You can cock it forward or to whatever side you prefer. It's great for keeping a little sun out of your eyes.

[Nick the DSM]

Nope. The earliest kilts (pre-1780, roughly) were generally pleated around the entire circumference.
....

Really?? whys is that?

[sirdaniel1975]

Really?? whys is that?

There have been times when I've gotten dressed in my belted plaid that I've had a few pleat looking folds in the front aprons. I normally straighten them out for aesthetic reasons.