Respected X-Markers

[thescot]

A gentleman's trousers should be half-lined. They fit better, do not stick to the legs, and do not reveal details of the undergarments. The lining is not hot.

In lieu of renting (hiring) a tux, just buy one. It will cost about the same, and you can always sell it later to recoup some of the cost. You can order a very servicable tux online with very little imagination. I've bought several that way myself.

Finally, pay close attention to Mac of Rath! Everything he said was dead on for gentlemen's evening dress.

And yes, be sure he ties his own tie; no pre-tied. If for no other reason than he will look very cool late in the evening when he simply unties his and lets the ends hang while the other guys unclip theirs and look . . . cheap.

[Bigkahuna]

There is a chap named Indie Magnoli, who make replicas of all the James Bond clothing including the Tuxedos. He might be worth a look.

[Lachlan09]

Here in Muscat, Oman, there aren’t dress-hire shops for men. Any chap wanting a dinner suit, tux, etc (even Red Sea Rig/Gulf Rig/Schooner Rig etc) has to own his own. Local Omani Arabs tend to tosh up in their best white dishdasha Arab gown with dark ornate gold-embroidered, gauze-like coat worn on top, fancy turban, silver waist-belt with ceremonial Khanjar dagger and best sandals.

My plan for a dinner suit is first to look at menswear shops which tend to sell French and Italian prêt-a-porter suits (the other is Indian ready to wear suits which aren’t anything like the quality – plus they don’t have Indian-made p.a.p. dinner suits etc). Half-expecting no luck, I will drive into Ruwi (which is a bazaar-like maze of streets, heavily-Indian influenced part of town) and go to an Indian tailor we’ve used to make everyday trousers for me, armed with my detailed requirements and of course my son. I’ll check out his materials, if needs be look elsewhere for materials too. I presume it will take a few fittings during the process. Should I buy the shoes first to ensure that at the fitting the trouser cuffs lie properly on the shoe ?

A couple of details which I’m thinking about ? Horizontal or sloping pockets ? Pocket flaps or no ? Jetted pocket slits instead or as well as pocket flaps ? Hugo Boss trims his jetted pockets with narrow silk edging. Idea or not ? Box-style jacket or waisted ? Front darts or not ? Vents – none ? centre ? sides ? What length of vents if used ? What sort of panelling to back and sides ? Trousers – pleated front or plain front ?

The more I think about it, the deeper it gets !

[Bugbear]

* Sorry, listen to MacMillan of Rathdown, not me. He knows what he's talking about. *
I'm out.

[MacMillan of Rathdown]

Should I buy the shoes first to ensure that at the fitting the trouser cuffs lie properly on the shoe ?

Yes.

A couple of details which I’m thinking about ? Horizontal or sloping pockets ? Pocket flaps or no ? Jetted pocket slits instead or as well as pocket flaps ?

I would opt for jetted pocket slits (trimmed with the same satin as the lapels) with flaps. Either horizontal or slanted pockets are apporpriate.

Box-style jacket or waisted ? Front darts or not ? Vents – none ? centre ? sides ? What length of vents if used ? What sort of panelling to back and sides ?

I'd go with a waisted jacket with a double vent in the back.

Trousers – pleated front or plain front ?

Go with the plain front, it gives a slimmer appearance. Pleats are more appropriate with tails.

The more I think about it, the deeper it gets !

Don't over-think this. If "style" is the overriding factor, take him in and let him choose something "off the peg" (Pierre Cardin as opposed to Hugo Boss). If you are determined to go the "bespoke route" then instruct your tailor to make your son's dinner clothes as conservative as possible. My experience in India was that it was helpful to hand my tailor a picture of the sort of suit I wanted, just to make sure we were on the same waive length. You might want to do the same.

[Lachlan09]

Thanks all - that has given me a lot of good direction.

I'll photo the results !

[MacLowlife]

I think formal wear falls into two big groups- Up to the minute and dated before you take it off, or slightly (charmingly, suavely) behind the times. Being old myself, I am in favor of the latter. When I was 17, I believe I was actually photographed in something the color of hot cocoa, with velvet lapels. I would not let the tailor get too carried away with "modern" styling on the jacket- get it one-button single breasted with peak lapels, or possibly two. None of this high gorge stuff. Single Breasted makes much more sense in the heat. Where you are, the hand labor to make buttonholes is cheap, so go ahead and have them on the sleeves. Leave it to the young master to decide whether or not to show them off. I have seen plenty of nice formal jackets with a single cuff button, but I think 3 or 4 is nicer and more generally the case. Yes, go with MoR and the slight waist to the jacket- he is young and svelte and might as well look it. I like Ted Crocker's suggestion about slightly shorter vents- again, just a little retro and very cool.

He is unlikely to change his wallet position just because he is wearing black tie, and many younger guys prefer the back pocket of their trou. No pockets in the back would be neater, but it would be a right PITA if he expected to put his billfold where no pocket existed.

Sad to say, but you can find a picture of James Bond wearing every imaginable kind of Black Tie rig, some of which are hideous. I think Connery is still the man, but whatever you do, don't let your child leave the house in a see through formal shirt without a decent ( sweat absorbing) undershirt beneath it, like George Lazenby wore.

Oh, and get it a touch big, since he will gain weight before you want to buy him another one.

[Lachlan09]

Thanks everyone - excellent advice and this week we're off to the tailor's to get him measured up and choose materials etc. I want to allow plenty time for the June event.

[Lachlan09]

We’ll be getting a ready-made bow-tie for now (I don’t think DIY are available anyway). I think real bow-ties are classier, especially when untied late in the evening and the ends left to hang down.

Are real bow-ties difficult to tie ? I’ve seen step-by-step diagrams which look reasonably manageable, but seeing and doing can be entirely different !

What’s your experiences ?

[mbhandy]

Are real bow-ties difficult to tie ? I’ve seen step-by-step diagrams which look reasonably manageable, but seeing and doing can be entirely different !

What’s your experiences ?

Real Bow-ties are easy after the first two or three try's.
First time was hard looking in the mirror then I tried just closing my eyes and thinking it was a shoe lace.

MrBill