Not a boot, not a brogue, but...

**Tobus** · 10th November 10, 10:55 AM

I think you misunderstand the way the Scots think about kilts and apart from the military the kilt is most certainly not regarded as a uniform. What they have is years, 100's of years perhaps, of subconscious knowledge of what looks right and what does not.

Yes, I understand that. What I meant by my 'uniform' comment is that, as your posts on this forum indicate, such traditional Scottish views on what's "right" with the kilt are so narrow that they might as well be considered a uniform, since they obviously leave no room for non-traditional styles.

The OP's question didn't seem to indicate that he was asking only for answers within the narrow confines of traditional Highland sartorial protocols. I'm guessing he would have placed this thread in the Traditional Highland Dress forum if that were the case. In fact, judging by the options he was considering, I think it's a safe assumption that he was looking for general input on what people think looks right with a kilt from a broader spectrum, although it would certainly be his prerogative to clarify that point if he wishes.

The shoe that you have illustrated are fine for most day and informal evening events and those are one the types that I had in mind for people to start with. What grates are the trainer type of shoe when worn with the kilt, although perhaps the Tartan Army manoeuvres or on the beach would be more appropriate for those types of shoe.There are plenty of shoes with 4wd style tread if required and still look the business with the kilt without resorting to inappropriate foot wear.

"Inappropriate" being a subjective term, of course. There's certainly a time and place for doing it in "proper Highland fashion" (and believe it or not, I prefer the traditional look), but as I intimated previously, such traditions don't always coincide with comfort or casual settings. If Highlanders offer no traditions for casual wear, why is it "inappropriate" for people to create their own casual styles?

I suppose my main point was that if anything not 'traditional' is seen as 'inappropriate', then it IS a uniform whether one admits it or not.

**Jock Scot** · 10th November 10, 11:08 AM

Tobus.

I am sorry I may have caused a misunderstanding, by using the word "inappropriate". By using that word I do not mean "right" or "wrong", I mean "pleasing to the eye", "proportion", "scale" and this is where many kilt wearers seem to miss the point. Yes of course a shoe is a shoe is a shoe, and some look easy on the eye when worn with the kilt and some offend the eye. Just like wearing sandals with a dress uniform might be "inappropriate", in this case, also probably "wrong" too!

It is another one of those exclusively British and unfathomable "its just not done Old Boy" type things that seem to be totally lost on other nations. As Scotland is in Britain, I suppose it is not surprising that the rest of the world fail to understand the subtleties of "our" dress!!!!!!!!

**Vegan Scot** · 10th November 10, 11:33 AM

I guess the long and short of it is this; is there casual footwear which is appropriate (aesthetically pleasing) and neither traditional brogue nor "modern" boot? I think the answer, perhaps depending on who you ask, is yes. The next question is, and a few have answered already, what is that casual, aesthetically pleasing footwear?

**Jock Scot** · 10th November 10, 11:55 AM

Originally Posted by vegan_scot

I guess the long and short of it is this; is there casual footwear which is appropriate (aesthetically pleasing) and neither traditional brogue nor "modern" boot? I think the answer, perhaps depending on who you ask, is yes. The next question is, and a few have answered already, what is that casual, aesthetically pleasing footwear?

Good point.

Ok,I am not saying these are every one's cup of tea, but I wear these when on the hill, by the river or just country casuals for "Jock" and his kilt. I prefer black, but I have not got a picture of those!

**mull** · 10th November 10, 12:23 PM

Jock,
Those are wonderful shoes, but I have never seen anything close to them except on a golf course. Where could something similar be found?
Joe

**tripleblessed** · 10th November 10, 01:24 PM

Jock, those do look both appropriate and functional. I sure we'd all love to see
yours in their native habitat doing their job, if that would be within your comfort
level.

A seconding on where to find, or are they bespoke?

**thescot** · 10th November 10, 01:39 PM

I often wear brown, mock toed boat shoes
http://www.sperrytopsider.com/store/...tId=cat90046DM
or plain loafers when very casually dressed.
http://www.llbean.com/llb/shop/18263..._Base&subrnd=0

(In my lexicon, "casual" = sweater or open collar with brown day sporran and usally lovat green hose.)

I also have a little nicer pair of cap toed shoes in cordovan like this for a little bit smarter look:
http://www.menswearhouse.com/webapp/...LAID=343824260

For hiking or generally being where a good shoe might be scratched or otherwise damaged, I'd go for something like this only all tan and cheaper:

http://shop.timberland.com/product/i...ductId=4208961

Being old and crotchety, I am of the opinon that grown men shoul not wear running shoes unles they are running. Leather is always my choice unless I'm at the beach, and then I am not kilted!

**thescot** · 10th November 10, 01:41 PM

Originally Posted by Jock Scot

Good point.

Ok,I am not saying these are every one's cup of tea, but I wear these when on the hill, by the river or just country casuals for "Jock" and his kilt. I prefer black, but I have not got a picture of those!

Dang, Jock. I really like those. I can see where this is headed; they probably cost a fotune, and I'm in for another big purchase!

**BoldHighlander** · 10th November 10, 02:25 PM

Originally Posted by thescot

Dang, Jock. I really like those. I can see where this is headed; they probably cost a fotune, and I'm in for another big purchase!

You & me both Jim! {sigh}

**Jock Scot** · 10th November 10, 02:27 PM

Now, are we talking in that modern code that is being talked about on another thread? No! Not hardly!

These particular shoes come from "Hoggs of Fife" and they can be found on the Internet. These, I think, are called "hill shoes". Not cheap but considerably cheaper than bespoke ones--- I have two pairs of those and I have no intention of buying more and they don't get the treatment that these do! The "hill shoe" from Hoggs last for ever! I used to give mine a real bashing and apart from replacing the laces I think I have 4 pairs. They don't wear out, they just get very very tatty---eventually!! The ones in the picture have had an easier life, but are two years old----the laces are new.I can't remember the cost, but I think about £155.Dancing pumps they are not, comfortable they are.

Some one wanted an "action" picture.