The Tweed Argyll.

[Jock Scot]

I have had this niggling thought in my head for quite a time now and a couple of interesting threads on the go at the moment have brought it to the fore. Now this is not a criticism of any one's choices, its more an observation and I do wonder if the tweed Argyll (plus waist coat in some circumstances) and its role with the kilt is misunderstood.

When I say tweed argyll I include the crail, the braemar and any other style of tweed day kilt jacket under the same heading. None is more or less formal than the other and are just a slightly different variation of style, nothing more and in the end which style we choose matters not. The use of "day" in its description also can and I think does cause confusion with some too.

The tweed argyll can and is worn to events varying from a BBQ to weddings, funerals, drinks dos, lunches, business meetings, meeting Royalty and so on during the day and is also well suited to some of the more informal evening events too. The colour matters not and all this nonsense of black tweed, for this and grey tweed for that and one colour is more formal than another is well just that -----nonsense!

A tweed argyll fits the role of a business suit, lounge suit, sports jacket, blazer all in one and I have to say that many here seem to fail to understand this. Now much of this I think stems from a lack of experience, a lack of confidence, a lack of knowledge, cultural differences and even climate considerations all of which is perfectly understandable and reasonable and I do recognise full well those situations.

Now in Scotland, we on the whole understand,(we ought to!) the place of the tweed argyll simply because we have grown up with it and that is an advantage that many of you don't have. We also have no such worries on colours either and assorted shades of greens, browns,blues, mixtures of colours, herringbone, this check, that check, hounds-tooth patterns and so on are all perfectly acceptable to us Scots. We also might have more than one tweed argyll in our wardrobe and the new one might be let loose for weddings and the tatty one might venture out on the hill for a walk.

So how about being a tad more adventurous you chaps outwith Scotland and you will be amazed how versatile a tweed argyll can be.

[BoldHighlander]

Bravo!

Very well laid out Jock. And while I myself was under no illusions regarding the tweed Argyll (a benefit of being on here since 2006 & having carefully read the advice of such gentlemen as yourself over that period of time ), I want to thank you for sharing your insightful thoughts & experience with the rabble!

I hope it will help others better understand Highland attire, and the role of the tweed Argyll in particular.

Cheers!

[Downunder Kilt]

Jock I could not agree with you more. I have 5 tweed jackets, a lovat green, a highland green with waistcoat, a grey with waistcoat, a green based harris tweed and a brown check. I have worn them to weddings, funerals, church. out to dinner, to highland games, functions that have stared in the daytime and gone into the night. You are correct in saying that they are the most versitile jacket one could possible own. With a couple of waistcoats, matching or not, they become a endless source of variation in the wardrobe.

As has been stated on many threads people get too hung up on over thinking about their outfit and what goes with what.

[gary meakin]

Thanks for the info Jock.
All I own is a black argyle and I wear that to be dressed up.
Having no other jacket, I'm either dressed up or casual.
The argyle tweed is my next purchase.
I'll be printing off your comments to show my wife so she can see why it's necessary for me to get one

[ForresterModern]

So what you are saying is that a tweed jacket with or without vest can be worn just about anywhere, such as:


To the horse races, or:


To work, or:


To a traditional Scottish Highland Games (Glamis Castle, Strathmore, UK June 2008), or:


To a different highland games on a different continent (Stone Mtn Games, Atlanta Oct 2010), or:


To meet with some fellow Xmarkers at that same different Highland Games on a different continent, or:


To give a lecture (pardon the flat cap, I really did take it off when I went into the lecture hall), or

Just about anywhere you wanted to look nice. Is that what you meant, Jock?

jeff

[Jock Scot]

Ughhhh, shiver! That damned flat cap! You do that on purpose! Now admit it,you do! LOL

Back to the tweed argyll, yes absolutely Jeff and very smart you and the others look. Apart from that-------! Although the 60 year old battered, much repaired and dearly loved tweed argyll belonging to a long deceased relative does have a place in less smart surroundings.

It has been said before, but it won't hurt by saying it again that a tweed argyll is not really suitable for dress(formal) occasions. Bare in mind in UK terms "dress" means formal wear, as I understand it, "dress" in the US(elsewhere too?) means something a bit different, such as smart business attire.

[ForresterModern]

Ughhhh, shiver! That damned flat cap! You do that on purpose! Now admit it,you do! LOL

Back to the tweed argyll, yes absolutely Jeff and very smart you and the others look. Apart from that-------! Although the 60 year old battered, much repaired and dearly loved tweed argyll belonging to a long deceased relative does have a place in less smart surroundings.

It has been said before, but it won't hurt by saying it again that a tweed argyll is not really suitable for dress(formal) occasions. Bare in mind in UK terms "dress" means formal wear, as I understand it, "dress" in the US(elsewhere too?) means something a bit different, such as smart business attire.

Who, Jock, me? Taunt you with a flat cap on purpose? Would I do that? No, never......okay, well, maybe once in a while. Keeps you on your toes.

As my tweeds are of recent vintage (no one else in my family claiming their scottish heritage much out loud for the last 400 years or more, best we can tell) they will be handed down to my sons and hopefully in 60 years (long after I am "shadows and dust", worn by my sons and grandsons with pride, along with my kilts. Tradition has to start, or in this case be reborn, somewhere.

I wear my tweeds just about every opportunity I can find an excuse to (only have to justify it to a wife who is not fond of the kilt----yet). Funny from a guy who was always so underdressed in my youth (sandals, holes in my jeans, long unkempt hair and unshorn face---heck I even wore a sweater, tie, and chinos to my med school interviews before buying a secondhand ill fitting tweed jacket) that I take dressing mush more seriously now than ever before. Dressed with a purpose. And flat-capped just to pi$$ of Jock once in a while.

j

[Jordan]

What your saying about tweed is interesting Jock, most people of my age think that putting on a shirt is looking smart and rarely if ever wear jackets.
A good example Was on new years day I went out to my local golf club for a drink to welcome in the new year and since there was a do on I had on a blue shirt with my tie jacket and waistcoat. Nothing too formal but smart and I think I looked quite sharp if I do say so myself. By the time I got there I felt like a piper. There were a few kilts in attendance (mostly with Jacobite shirts White hose and a dress sporran) but the only people who had in jackets were the pipers and even then not all of them did.

It seems that most people in my age group (18-25 ish) think that dressing for the occasion or to go out means wearing a shirt!

It was the same in the evening I chose not to wear my jacket just had the shirt and waistcoat on but I still had lots of questions asking what the occasion was.

Unfortunately standards of dress are slipping I would like a nice tweed jacket but I doubt i would ever wear it due to the fact I can hardly find an occasion to wear a shirt and tie nowadays never mind a jacket too.

Jordan

[auld argonian]

When I do wear the kilt, I try to make it look like it's just a regular part of the wardrobe...don't know how well I succeed in that but that would seem to be the ideal.

Total agreement with the indispensibility of a tweed jacket: a wardrobe essential but one that seems to have fallen out of favor with the "younger" set (and I'm not that old). Guess that it's associated with "old farts" like dusty college professors (suede elbow patches included) and antique flyfishers as seen in vintage copies of Field and Stream magazine (though showing up to fish in a tweed jacket would really freak out the other guys out there).

Have worn tweed jackets since high school so they're second nature by now. Often wear one with a sweater and jeans...what was once called the "preppie" look but, hell, that's how we all dressed when I was a kid.

The tweed jacket just looks right with the kilt and I keep an eye out for the right one all the time. Got one in the charcoal color a while back but it really is too dark and I'll probably de-accession it soon...a nice neutral mid-grey seems to be the right color. I found a very nice standard cut jacket that's neutral, moderately vintage and has those perfect-for-a-kilt-modification patch pockets at a resale store and snapped it up (it was labelled "Marshall Field's, the now defunct Chicago department store). But...it being perfect the way it is, I decided that I will not try to have it modified into a kilt jacket...it'd just be a waste of a really nice jacket and, let's face it, a kilt jacket that was made to be a kilt jacket looks much better than something that was altered to look like a kilt jacket.

I always think that a good tweed jacket should have that same quality as Rumpole of The Bailey's hat is described: slightly disreputable. In a perfect world, it should be obvious that it's a quality piece of goods that has been well used and well loved and, though a bit worn, the quality still shines through.

Hopefully, that same quality should apply to the wearer.

Best

AA

[MacMillans son]

Thanks Jock!

Your post is very timely for me as I have been recently considering (fretting) all of the things that you listed; sleeve style, color, tweed pattern etc. and trying to match them to the type of event I am most likely to attend. All of which fit into the group you listed as appropriate for tweed.

I still tend to follow my North American tendencies toward color/tone matching, but am getting a bit more relaxed about that.

My only "yet to be decided" is the sleeve style, (currently have it down to Braemar or Crail), but will just have to commit and pull the trigger!


Thanks for your continued input and support for those of us not raised in the culture, it really helps a lot.

Best Regards,
Brooke