I LOVE 'Em!! J'Dez Underkilts

[Iolaus]

Bring on the skirted hordes of girlie men...let us to war!

Bear, you're point!

Ron

From what I understand, the war was what instigated the development of this site. Do we really want to repeat history?

I understand Bear's point. I'm not ready to draw a line in the sand, but a line will have to be drawn at some point. I think Bear may be drawing it here, with this manufacturer, because J'Dez is trying to pass off feminine style clothing as men's wear in the other lines he sells, and this is simply a renaming of a traditionally feminine undergarment. Perhaps if he had come to the kilt-wearing community for suggestions, and developed something on our recommendations that addressed our needs and and took into account our preferences (such as that loincloth idea someone had) then he might have gotten a better reception.

Don't get me wrong, I understand the desire for an undergarment of some kind, but part of the premise for this site is to define the masculine from the feminie, and if when shown a picture of the "underkilt, my wife said "That's a slip," then I'd say it's awfully close to the line.

[Bob C]

Someone help me out here where does J'Dez refer to the product they call underkilts as kilts?

Ron

I was not referring to the "underkilt" in that instance. I was referring to things such as this: http://www.jdez.com/men/20101.html

[Colin]

Personally would rather just wear underwear than to put on a slip (call it an underkilt if you like, but it's still a slip). The majority of traditional kilts I have seen all have a cloth liner attached to the back anyway, so I am not sure why you would need any more of a liner, but that's just me.

Alot of people have mentioned the threads at Tom's but have not seen them, so here they are:
http://www.tomscafe.org/forums/showt...?threadid=8180
http://www.tomscafe.org/forums/showt...?threadid=8215

I was still visiting Tom's when all the ***** went down, and it is starting to look familiar. Bear is not over reacting, as quite a few of us watched a good site turn into a joke. While you are over there checking out the threads listed above, read up on the high heels, the body hair removal, and the new "kilt" for sale at the GAP in the women's section.

Personally I think the use of the word KILT being used to sell products which are most definetely not kilts comes down to a lack of respect for a culture and it's customs. In many parts of North America the desire for a deal has over ridden our sense of decency. Why would you pay $500 for a kilt from Scotland when Walmart has something close for under $20 and people won't know the difference? Well you wouldn't unless you had respect for what the kilt stood for. How many times have we seen people from the UK tell us not to buy the $50 knock off kilts only fit for hanging on a wall, and yet the North Americans don't see anything wrong with it? It's a lack of respect through a lack of education. How can we as kilt wearers educate people and expect to be taken seriously if the general public is being told that these:
http://www.neimanmarcus.com/store/ca...d=prod22660147
and these: (yes the GUYS at Tom's are buying them and toting them as "real" kilts)
http://www.gap.com/browse/product.do...730&pid=325932
http://www.gap.com/browse/product.do...730&pid=325932
are being sold to the general public as "kilts"? If men's skirts are ever going to become a viable market, they need to creat their own path and history and stopping trying to sneak past under our kilts.

Just my 2 bits

Oh, and I could be wrong, but I seem to remember threads about sarongs either being moved or deleted because they had nothing to do with kilts, but that was a long time ago so I don't remember the exact details.

(*** Notice I didn't just pick on products from J'DEZ)

[Ruanaidh]

Did you notice the price at that sk!&t at NM? For that amount of money you could buy a REAL 16 oz. handsewn beauty - if you only knew better!

[Colin]

Did you notice the price at that sk!&t at NM? For that amount of money you could buy a REAL 16 oz. handsewn beauty - if you only knew better!

you said it Ruanaidh, unfortunately it is marketed as a "kilt".

.....if they only knew better.......

[KiltedCodeWarrior]

And not only the price, but did you see how long that thing was? Definitely sk$%t length!

[Riverkilt]

Hmmm, going by memory here but think of my kilts only Pittsburgh Kilts and Freedom Kilts have any kind of "lining" and that's on the back. I know my hand sewns don't...a key reason I like this product.

For all the "stuff" I just keep coming back to "It works for me." If it doesn't work for you fine.

Fear is that if it hadn't been brought to a kilt board I'd never have known about it probably.

Still puzzled how a few girlie men can threaten hundreds of years of entrenched Scottish/Celtic kilted masculine tradition dripping with testosterone.

[Sindarius]

Personally would rather just wear underwear than to put on a slip (call it an underkilt if you like, but it's still a slip).

Here Here, I'll drink to that . and... here's my two cents for what they are worth. I've never been kilt checked but I won't rule out that it could happen. I can not for the life of me imagine my embarresment if I was kilt checked by a pretty las who discovered a slip under my kilt. Call it an underkilt, call it a kilt protector, call it what you will. I call it a slip. I prefer regimental, not because I want to flash the world if I am kilt checked or the victim of a windy day but for tradition. Comfort - never been a problem. Cleanliness - never been a problem. Should comfort ever become a problem I'll wear my boxers but I most certainly will not be wearing a slip regardless of what it is marketed as.

Respectfully,
Bryan

[flyv65]

What is this "underwear" of which you people speak? :grin:

Honestly guys: for people who use "small clothes", Rob's report was handy and informative; for me it was a bit less useful, but isn't that an individual's decision? I have a friend who believes that, much like cheap whiskey and pornography, there is a time and a place to flyfish with nymph patterns-but one certainly doesn't discuss them in the company of ladies. Another friend of ours has announced (under the influence of the aforementioned cheap whiskey), that if they made fishing illegal he'd jacklight them at night and use a pitchfork if he had to.

Personal choice, gentlemen; that's all I'm saying on the underkilts issue.

Bryan...I like dryflys, but I'd probably use a pitchfork in the end...

[NancyMan]

A week ago today I received my Freedom Kilt. (Ordered back in the summer when cold weather wasn't on my mind.) Buttoned it up and soon realized that the poly/cotton fabric didn't have the insulating qualities of my STW acrylic heavyweight. I slipped on a pair of boxer briefs, which helped, but just felt weird after going 6 months regimental. What to do? Then I recalled this old thread that Ron started. I was intrigued by the idea of the underkilt, but choked on the cost of the things. (See my signature at the bottom.) Too late to order before Xmas anyhoo...

I made a trip to my local thrift store. Found a couple of, ahem, skirts that were constructed just like the J'Dez garments. One a toasty acrylic and the other a cotton- both priced at about $6. I cut them both to 21 inches in length and gave them a quick hem on the sewing machine. Not only am I now able to wear my new FK (a review will follow shortly), but all of my lightweight kilts just became available for winter wear too.

OK, so now you know what I'm wearing under my kilt and why I've got a smile on my face rather than clenched, teeth. But nobody else needs to know, right? Cause its none of their darn buisiness.

Have a cool Yule y'all,
Vincent