How much are you worth?

**ThistleDown** · 7th May 10, 08:44 PM

That was so thorough, CDN and far from silly. Makes me very proud to share a nationality (or two?) with you. And you were so polite in not pointing out the obvious: that wealth is really in the eye of the owner of the rice field, the folk who tend and harvest it, those who manufacture the bags and the scales and the twine, the ones who cart it about from here to there around the world (and their donkeys and oxen and lorry- and ship-builders and drivers/sailors), receivers and warehousers and distributors and haulers and -- finally -- the wee shop-keeper with the bag of rice to sell, if he has a buyer because he can keep the price somewhat in line with the income of his potential customer. Wherever in the world he is, of course.

Superbly done! Is there one among us who could do the same thing with any other grown or manufactured product: a dram, or a pint, or a yard/metre of tartan fabric?

**Pleater** · 8th May 10, 07:46 AM

The only other commodities I can think of which were used for paying salaries are the original one - the Roman army's salt, and the lady gold workers who were not actually paid directly at all, they just gathered up the tiny grains of gold from their bathtubs after a day's work, and kept their hair long to maximise gathering potential.

Anne the Pleater :ootd:

**Lallans** · 10th May 10, 10:00 AM

Originally Posted by haukehaien

I have a question about Clavell's novel - I know it's fiction and doesn't represent actual events, but how does his description of 17c Japanese culture stack up? In other words, is the world of Shogun very like the actual Japan of the time, wildly different, or somewhere in between? I love history, but know very little of the history and historical culture of that part of the world.

It's regarded as totally off base in Japan, as is every such novel written by Westerners that I've ever discussed with them. I rather think that 'mild contempt' might be close to the mark. It's like writing about something you know nothing about- only worse because you don't know that you don't know. In particular, Shogun really messed up the relationship between samurai and their leaders and it was for instance never, ever considered for airing in Japan, I mean of course the TV series based on the novel.

**CDNSushi** · 10th May 10, 08:06 PM

Originally Posted by Canuck of NI

It's regarded as totally off base in Japan, as is every such novel written by Westerners that I've ever discussed with them. I rather think that 'mild contempt' might be close to the mark. It's like writing about something you know nothing about- only worse because you don't know that you don't know. In particular, Shogun really messed up the relationship between samurai and their leaders and it was for instance never, ever considered for airing in Japan, I mean of course the TV series based on the novel.

True, but very often, however, the perception others have of us is very different than that what we have of ourselves. To a Japanese it may seem completely off-base, inaccurate, and even downright wrong. But to an outsider looking in, it may appear quite different. Which is correct? I'd say both have some merit and neither should be completely excluded.

As the great poet Burns wrote: "O wad some Power the giftie gie us to see oursels as ithers see us."

For Clavell's part, he spent time in the Pacific theatre during WWII in the Royal Artillery. He fought the Japanese in Malaysia, was captured, and held as a POW in Java. His novel King Rat is a fiction book, but draws very heavily from his own personal experiences as a POW of the Japanese.

To say that he wasn't coloured by his experiences would be simplistic. Rather than calling his portrayals of Japan "inaccurate" I would call them extensively influenced by personal experiences during a very difficult time.

**Bigkahuna** · 9th May 10, 07:19 AM

Can I have my Koku in Saki please???

**Wompet** · 9th May 10, 04:14 PM

Sheesh - after 1600 posts, I'm a Kilted Samurai again.
But given what my salary would have been in, say 1800, I'm not complaining (unless I don't get my daishō).

**CDNSushi** · 9th May 10, 05:30 PM

Originally Posted by Wompet

Sheesh - after 1600 posts, I'm a Kilted Samurai again.
But given what my salary would have been in, say 1800, I'm not complaining (unless I don't get my daishō).

Lol! Touché. This.

But just to briefly comment on what Gryphon noir said... Again, without getting too political, socialized health care isn't without its drawbacks. I have almost $500/month in deductions here in Japan. Of that, $300 are for health and pension, $100 (roughly) in federal taxes, $100 (roughly) in municipal taxes.

My health benefits cover 70% of all necessary medical (no cosmetic, or elective stuff), incl. dental, and 70% of prescription meds.

I don't know how much you Americans pay on average for your private health insurance, but I know that compared to Canada, I pay a lot more in Japan.

**Lachlan09** · 9th May 10, 08:20 PM

What demographic level would I be ? Perhaps a fugu-tester or the katana equivalent of a test-crash dummy.

**CDNSushi** · 10th May 10, 08:14 PM

As an additional note, if anyone is interested in comparing and contrasting what Clavell got right ad what he got wrong in his novel Shogun, there is a free PDF-format book available on the subject. It's called Learning from SHOGUN: Japanese History and Western Fantasy and it's available here: http://www.columbia.edu/~hds2/learning/

I have not read it, but it looks compelling and I'll have to add it to my "to-read" list.