"Military Officer's sporrans" on Ebay

[OC Richard]

Wasn't sure what forum this should be in, but here goes...

I follow kilt-related things on Ebay regularly and a constant irritation is purely civilian things being sold as military things.

The sellers nearly always go one better: the things are not just listed as "military" but "military officer's". A third level is often added, that being a specific war, usually the Boer War (for some unknown reason).

Exhibit 1:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/SCOTTISH-MIL...item20fb2f07cf

Exhibit 2:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/SCOTTISH-MIL...item20fb2f07cb

And it's not just sporrans, but kilts and jackets...

Exhibit 3:

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Mens-Unique-...item234ff5a41a

(The jacket is not unique, nor military, but a common civilian pattern.)

[auld argonian]

I guessing that we can write this off to either pure ignorance or some "enterprising" individual trying to hype the goods hoping for a bigger cash out on ebay.

Face it, your average schmoe just doesn't know what the ins and outs of kilt related accoutrements are.

Best,

AA

[plaid preacher]

Richard, two of the three I can kind of understand .... kind of. The first sporran seems to have a name and rank written inside it and so the auction site just leaped to the conclusion it was military; although in no way resembling a military pattern sporran. (it is, however, a beautiful sporran). And the tag inside the jacket does say "military tailor". Now again, there is a gigantic leap made that therefore every jacket made by this tailor was for the military. So I can understand what is going on. It is still incorrect ... but understandable. As for the second sporran, the closest I can come is that it appears to have been repaired by what we used to call "gun tape" when I was in the service.

[Reiver]

By this measure all of my Scots gear is military. Pretty ebay typical but interesting nonetheless.
1st sporran is interesting but it looks a bit the worse for wear from the backside. The name/date (Nov 2000) doesn't quite match up with the look/age of the piece.
Pig in a poke.

[OC Richard]

It can get confusing with Highland Dress in particular because Thomas Gordon & Son made kilts and jackets for both the civilian trade and for the Army.

In fact they often made doublets precisely like those for the Army, for civilian pipe bands. These can only be distinguished by the buttons... but, missing the buttons, it can't be told unless there's an Army label.

With kilts, sporrans, and the like the same firms often made things for the Army and civilian trade but the patterns were clearly different.

Anyhow those three listings in the OP are obvious civilian items (obvious to me anyhow). It is strange than a military man would write his name and rank on his mufti.

[Jock Scot]

It is quite possible, probable even, a civilian sporran will have name and rank of the owner on and it is very likely that a tailor that made, or provided, uniforms and the civilian attire. How come?

Well, Officers wanting to cut a dash whilst not in uniform could easily order a civilian set of kilt attire whilst ordering a uniform. Sensible really, when getting measured up for the uniform, might as well get a civilian outfit while I am at it, type thing. On both sets of attire the rank and name of the tailors client will be placed discreetly somewhere as a matter of course. It is a completely honest and practical thing to do. Even today some Regiments of the British Army have a very large influence on how their Officers should be attired in some aspects of civilian life. The dark suit, bowler hat, regimental tie and the Swaine Adeney & Brigg brolly is a classic example of this.

There must still be countless thousands of leather, or, canvas suit cases, sporting gun gases, rod cases, fishing reel cases, binocular cases, collar boxes and assorted other civilian goods dotted about the UK and the "Empire" with names and rank of the owners on them, who have now passed on, retired or have got themselves promoted since taking ownership of them.