Scottish Patriotism

[derosa]

Why the hell is everyone piling on Patrick? All he is saying is that he is proud of his Scottish heritage and is patriotic about his nation and nationality.

We are seeing a lot of arbitrary anti this-and-that all over the world. I fully understand his comments alluding to an all too common lack of pride and interest in history/heritage/nationalism among many these days.

It doesn't feel like a piling on so much as the asking for greater understanding of what is meant. Patriotism is in many ways an ephemeral idea that is hard to pin down. For some military service is proof of patriotism and while those who don't follow lock-step with the government should "love it or leave". While people involved in social movements may see themselves as patriotic for wanting to make their country better. My father and father-in-law can argue over whether kneeling for the national anthem is patriotic and if it respects/disrespects their military service. Both the Alt-Right and Antifa here in the US view themselves as patriotic; the issue is that both judge patriotism by their standards. So who is to judge what is patriotic? Probably Steve has the best quote on it to begin with and from there it's all personal and dangerous to pass judgement.

[Father Bill]

A general, non-specific, non-personal shot across the bow folks. This is a topic that could go bad very easily. I'm not criticizing anyone's posts or any individual, just worried that this one could easily cause some hard feeling and flags.

Cheers & Best Wishes,

Father Bill for the Forum Moderators.

[PatrickHughes123]

It doesn't feel like a piling on so much as the asking for greater understanding of what is meant. Patriotism is in many ways an ephemeral idea that is hard to pin down. For some military service is proof of patriotism and while those who don't follow lock-step with the government should "love it or leave". While people involved in social movements may see themselves as patriotic for wanting to make their country better. My father and father-in-law can argue over whether kneeling for the national anthem is patriotic and if it respects/disrespects their military service. Both the Alt-Right and Antifa here in the US view themselves as patriotic; the issue is that both judge patriotism by their standards. So who is to judge what is patriotic? Probably Steve has the best quote on it to begin with and from there it's all personal and dangerous to pass judgement.

Derosa, you're kind of going into politics there. This is against the rules, this wasn't meant to be political.

[PatrickHughes123]

A general, non-specific, non-personal shot across the bow folks. This is a topic that could go bad very easily. I'm not criticizing anyone's posts or any individual, just worried that this one could easily cause some hard feeling and flags.

Cheers & Best Wishes,

Father Bill for the Forum Moderators.

Father Bill, I submit this in the most respectful way possible. I asked a simple question.

In Glasgow, while people do love their football team and can love their country through football, above that, they aren't really that patriotic. They have no sense of culture when it comes to things like whiskey, kilts, bagpipes, Gaelic, Scots Leid, Clans, St Andrews Flag, Lion Rampant and things like that. It's only football they love, not their actual culture or what it means to be a Scotsman.

[tpa]

Father Bill, I submit this in the most respectful way possible. I asked a simple question.

In Glasgow, while people do love their football team and can love their country through football, above that, they aren't really that patriotic. They have no sense of culture when it comes to things like whiskey, kilts, bagpipes, Gaelic, Scots Leid, Clans, St Andrews Flag, Lion Rampant and things like that. It's only football they love, not their actual culture or what it means to be a Scotsman.

I can't speak for Glaswegians and I have no interest in football but for many of the rest of us, although we may never express it, you can take the Scot out of Scotland, but you can never take Scotland out of the Scot.

[CollinMacD]

Father Bill, think we are walking a tightrope here, as this topic is very subjective, can result is some real emotion, and there is no answer that all will agree with. Agree, could get nasty very quick.

[Baeau]

Father Bill, think we are walking a tightrope here, as this topic is very subjective, can result is some real emotion, and there is no answer that all will agree with. Agree, could get nasty very quick.

The word, subjective, is the detonator in any discussion/argument/feud, or what have you. Most any comment, regarding any subject, made by any one, might/can/will be found objectionable based on some other's thoughts/ideas/ideals/et cetera. From patriotism to food. I have been told, that I'm un-American. Specific statement, "What kind of American are you?!? Simply, because I don't follow baseball, football, or basketball. Also, because we drive an aging Range Rover & Land Rover. We don't fit someone's stereotype, so we are ostracized....no problem, it's only the anti kilt father-in-law. His attitudes have ignited some serious skirmishes.

On the forum, & given the subject, this could get very ugly. Hopefully, none will push this over the edge, leading to Moderator action.

[Father Bill]

Well folks, there's already one flag. Anybody else want to push their luck?

[PatrickHughes123]

Well folks, there's already one flag. Anybody else want to push their luck?

On this thread?

[Father Bill]

On this thread?

Actually, there are now two on this thread. As I suggested, it's a dangerous topic.