WHY do I have to ask?

[Perldog007]

You don't have to ask. I did not. I told them I was going to and then did it.

My personal circumstances dictated my choice. My job is not much to lose and survival does not depend on it.

Seven years ago when I was tied to a condo mortgage in the D.C. Metro area different story.

Remember, rights are an artificial concept existing only in the fragile mindspace of humans. In Nature you have the right to bust a move.

Good Luck -- Doug

[Phil]

It really depends on your employer and how much you want the job. Places that go on about "team-players" expect everyone to be a clone of the boss. I wouldn't ask though because the knee-jerk reaction to that is almost bound to be no.

[cavscout]

There's no need to ask permission, just do it. BUT, be prepared to counter any objections in a non-defensive, logical and respectful manner.

If you respond defensively it reinforces their position that kilts are inappropriate in some way, though they may not know what way. Sarcasm and snide comebacks will work against your ultimate goal as well.

Make sure the outfit is well put together so as to present yourself as you would any other day wearing pants, except today you are wearing a kilt. DO NOT walk in looking like you just stepped out of a Renn Fair.

People will accept kilts as contemporary ware if WE present them as such.

[Riverkilt]

Phil's right. It depends on your "corporate culture."

I didn't ask when I started wearing kilts to work three years ago (mental health outpatient treatment agency with a strong policy of diversity). Like you, I didn't think I "needed" to ask permission. Got the usual peer teasing and questions but just kilted on.

After about a year of part time kilting at work I screwed up my courage (it does take courage folks), and went full time. Both my CEO and then supervisor asked, "What is it? Kilt week?" I replied, "Yes" to both. I'd been kilted full time for about two years when my recent troubles began with an edict to stop wearing kilts or be fired. No fun. I've just completed two or three months without kilts while I appealed. I eventually won the appeal - but more on the CEO's frustration with the process than anything I wrote in the appeals. A bit of a hollow victory.

I return to kilts when I'm back to work next Wednesday, feeling like the whole "first time to work kilted" process is beginning again. Kinda scary even for this old bird. I've worked underground in the mines, been a cop, Marine, worked in prisons, psychiatric wards, detox...nothing scares me...except the prospect of being summarily fired in a right-to-work state because I've angered the boss.

I can only hope the process has been as demoralizing for the CEO as it has been for me and that will discourage him from initiating a "no kilts" policy for a third time. If he does I'm better organized for the next appeal.

Knowing all this, would I ask if I had to do it all over again? No, I wouldn't. I believe companies should (boy am I naive or what?) stand behind their stated policies. Sadly, in real life they often put forth such policy for show and don't really mean it.

If there is a hassle, expect the same arguments thrown at women when they wore pants in the workplace 60 years ago...unprofessional...disruptive....our town isn't ready for that yet...

Good luck. I know Bozeman and it seems similar in culture to my little town.

Ron

[pdcorlis]

I sure understand the logic of black boxers but I still wear tartan boxers under my kilt. I teach at a college and to be honest - a guy in a kilt with tartan boxers is beyond boring compared to what I see "young ladies" wearing on campus.

[Archangel]

There is an odd argument that comes up every once in a while. It asks that women are not requested to be careful about their modesty.

I would imagine that the "authority" asking assumes that most women know the risks of exposing (and then it's their choice), whereas kilted men may not have that awareness from life-long experience. I have seen some gross examples of this. Heck, I had to learn how to tie my shoes all over again (and how far over can I lean into the trunk on a windy day).

(One of the benefits of this forum is to learn those things somewhere else than a children's playground.)

They have the right to be reassured that you have the same concern.

[Demonnic]

Also, when it comes to the lower half of the body women don't have to be quite as careful of accidental exposure. Most of their plumbing is on the inside and doesn't hang down. Showing a bit more thigh than intended can have more disastrous side effects with the male species.

[BozemanboB]

Thank you to all for your inputs. I appreciate the support, opinions, and wisdom.

And now for the rest of the story...

My boss saw me once around town wearing my UK. He recognized me from his car and drove by yelling "Nice kilt!!" I didn't recognize him at the time, but tipped my hat to the compliment anyway.

The next week at work he asked if I get comments like that all the time. "Huh?" "The kilt! Do you get comments like that all the time?" "OOOOHHH!!! That was you!" I replied. Short conversation lacking any real substance followed.

A day later we were heading down the stairs to a company meeting and I asked "You know that kilt I wore? Do you think I could wear it he..." "No." He cut me off. "Really? You don't think so?" I asked, and his answer was just as adamant and short. That was about three years ago. I wish I hadn't asked...

Last year before the Christmas party (the first ever in company's 17-year history) I AGONIZED over whether or not I should wear a kilt and decided that I shouldn't because of his reaction. Well, at the party he asked why I wasn't wearing a kilt! ARRRGGGHHHH!!!!

Well, I've decided that I'm going to do my damnest to dump bifurcated garments from my life. Whenever I do yardwork I'll wear one. Going to the DIY store? Kilted. Saturday market - kilted. I'm making my own x-kilt (going fairly well so far, and there will be many more and then some of my own design!) and scraping together cash to buy enough kilts that I can dump pants entirely (with some exceptions, like off-site customer visits, and I'm fine with that). The biggest hold-up is ... work.

I've decided on my strategy: wear them everywhere and be seen by my coworkers. In some cases I'll switch into one at the end of the workday when I'm leaving. I'll wear one to the Christmas part this year, and at any other work-related off-hours functions. Once I think I've gotten enough exposure (ahem!) I'll bring up the subject again.

My goal is to make him and the pres of the company, who I run across in town rather frequently, realize that this is normal wear and not a costume. Also, if asked "do you always wear kilts?" I want my answer to be "whenever I'm not at work." Further, if lots of people at work have seen me wearing a kilt then the reaction at work will be minimal. In fact many coworkers have seen me kilted, and the reactions ran the normal spread.

Where I work has always been a very conservative place. When I was hired I was one of the most outspoken personalities in the place, and with my pony-tail (short) and earring (subtle) I really shook up the place.


I posted my original message to collect wisdom, and to understand if my employer is unreasonable. I completely understand why some employers aren't comfortable with men in kilts, as mine is currently, and now I have to try to make them comfortable with it in a way that won't cost me my job!

Thanks again.


I'll post pics of my xkilt when I get it done!

[Rigged]

Sounds to me like you have a well-reasoned strategy in the works. Best of luck to you. Still, men shouldn't have to ask permission to wear men's clothing to work.