IDEAL v. BUDGET

[Panache]

I didn't bother to list my ideal outfit because I think that we here on XMTS have a wonderful sense of "The Good Stuff"

Let's face it, there is nothing like a bespoke item made for you!

It doesn't matter if it is kilt hose, a jacket, a kilt, shoes, or a sgian dubh.

What I proposed above was a way acquire a solid collection of items that will fit in well with other people in highland attire who will be wearing bespoke clothing and not look shabby in comparison.

My goal was to offer frugal solutions to one on a tight budget who wanted to wear highland attire in a variety of situations. I also wanted these items to be useful for the owner even after they were able to afford nicer things.


There certainly are cheaper options (for instance buying a Stillwater Standard acrylic model kilt instead of the wool heavyweight). However the Heavyweight (especially with a few simple modifications) is going to look a LOT more like a traditional hand sewn kilt. It will also last and look good a lot longer than the acrylic one. Likewise, the Buzz Kidder sporran might not be the cheapest day wear sporran out there, but it will last for years and look good.

You will notice that I didn't choose a fur dress sporran to go with the formal outfit. I did for two reasons.

First, I strongly feel that the inexpensive leather ones with cantle look a whole lot better than the fur ones

Second, the leather one will work with outfits with the tweed jacket where a fur one would be a bit too fancy.

While it would be a cost savings to skip the Lewis hose and the traditional garter ties, I feel that nice hose really make a formal outfit work.

But consider how many people spend $$$ on a bespoke kilt, a beautifully made PC coatee, a fancy sporran, and brightly shined ghillie brogues to ruin everything with really cheap and thin kilt hose? Sorry traditionalists of XMTS, but to me white hose isn't the problem, cheap hose are! The better quality hose will help people noting that one's shoes are simpler (though a good polish will make them look far better) The red traditional garter ties will be a nice touch with any outfit.

Lastly, I didn't bother with the kilt pin or sgian dubh because they do make great (and easy gifts) and frankly while they are nice touches, they don't contribute that much to an overall outfit.

Cheers

Jamie :ootd:

[ForresterModern]

My turn to take a stab. I think I will likely disappoint some, but I agree with Jock and MacMurdo that the kilt is the centerpiece and should not be scrimped on except to a point. I think it should be a full 8yd 13-16oz traditional knife pleated klt, but am willing to let that for either level be a quality well fitted machine sewn from a reputable vendor rather than necessitate it being the all out handsewn---cheaper, and as long as it fits and is constructed well I think probably looks nearly as well, but comes in farther underbudget in most cases. Choose the tartan you lke best, preferably becasue it has some deep and personal meaning to you-----family, military servie, etc...

Everything else I say simply that I agree with Jock with one exception. My agreement is to buy quality in everything---price does not necessarily equate to quality, as some deals can be had on good stuff if you are a good scot and shop thriftily and well, but in genreal you do get what you pay for. My exception is that I personally do like a bit of variety, so I do have several kilts, several jackets and waistcoats, several belts and buckles, two pair of ghillies plus my casual shoes, numerous ties and headgear, and more than my fair share of nice quality but relatively inexpensive kilt pins and other minor paraphernalia (thanks to ebay) to help dress up the final look just a bit more and be able to add some variety to the wardrobe on an as needed basis.

I must admit I do not know enough yet to be able to do the full out dress regalia, and have limited stock and resources, so the upper end IDEAL stuff I am just not as familiar with to be able to comment too far in that arena. But I think so far I have done well and made quality yet frugal and well thought out, well sought out, purchases on my own budget, and that is what is important. The scot's way.

[Jock Scot]

When I buy something, be it, a plough, lorry, fishing rod, car, kilt, or anything else apart from day to day shopping, I have two things that I always ask myself.

1.The most expensive thing you(me) will ever buy, is something you really don't want.So do I really want it?
2.I must divorce need from necessity. In other words, I may need it, but is it really necessary?

Do I always get it right? No way, but it helps!

[The Guy in the Kilt at UC]

When I buy something, be it, a plough, lorry, fishing rod, car, kilt, or anything else apart from day to day shopping, I have two things that I always ask myself.

1.The most expensive thing you(me) will ever buy, is something you really don't want.So do I really want it?
2.I must divorce need from necessity. In other words, I may need it, but is it really necessary?

Do I always get it right? No way, but it helps!

Good advice. I've never heard it before, but I can see the wisdom in it.

[Detroitpete]

So I just did a 'copy and paste' of everything MacMillan and Jock Scot said and saved it in a file named "Kilt logic 101".

But then Jock HAD to mention fly rods and I looked over at my collection of hand made bamboo rods and my heart sank.

I'm going to need a second job

Seriously, I think there are great points being made hear about building one's kilt kit primarily from a point of quality and usefulness.

Great thread Matt!

(I'm going back to note taking now)

[Tattoo Bradley]

Ideal:

1. The kilt itself.
Handsewn, 16 oz. Scottish Tartan
Traditional 4 yd. box pleated OR 8 yd. knife pleated in your chosen tartan/hue

2. Shoes, daywear.
comfortable leather shoes, with an appropriate asthetic

3. Shoes, eveningwear.
well polished, high quality, black oxfords

4. Hose, daywear.
Lewis Kilt hose in complimentary colors, 2 pair

5. Hose, eveningwear.
Tartan hose in appropriate tartan

6. Sporran, daywear.
Brown leather, brass cantle sporran
Black leather, plain
Both high quality ie. L&M

7. Sporran, eveningwear.
Full Mask
or
Seal Skin with sterling silver cantle

8. Jacket and/or waistcoat, daywear.
Tweed argyll in a nice lovet or check with matching 5 button waist coat to compliment your tartan

9. Jacket and/or waistcoat, eveningwear.
Regulation Doublet in velvet or black barethea
waist coat in tartan matching that of the kilt
waist coat in matching velvet or black barethea as applicable

10. (Because it has to be a round number), your one other piece of personal advice.

Do not let yardage, tartan, and pleating styles (and the common misconceptions thereof) mislead you. Educate yourself on the differences, understand why there are differences, understand which differences are due to cost control and corner cutting, and understand which differences are that of style, tradition, and history.

Budget:

1. The kilt itself.
Handsewn, 16 oz. Scottish Tartan
Traditional 4 yd. box pleated OR 8 yd. knife pleated in your chosen tartan/hue

2. Shoes, daywear.
Comfortable leather shoes in appropriate style

3. Shoes, eveningwear.
well polished black oxfords

4. Hose, daywear.
complimentary colored hose, of highest quality you can afford, avoid the $10 "Highland Hose" whose sheer rivals that of pantyhose

5. Hose, eveningwear.
Hawick Lewis hose, in complimentary color, save pennies if necessary

6. Sporran, daywear.
Plain brown or black leather sporran, of highest quality you can afford

7. Sporran, eveningwear.
Fur sporran of reasonable quality, save pennies if necessary

8. Jacket and/or waistcoat, daywear.
Tweed argyll, haunt Ebay

9. Jacket and/or waistcoat, eveningwear.
Black barathea argyll with matching waist coat or matching tartan waist coat

10. (Because it has to be a round number), your one other piece of personal advice.

As has been stated several times: buy quality; period. Don't be afraid to haunt Ebay (but ensure you've done your homework and know what you're looking for.)

Do not let yardage, tartan, and pleating styles (and the common misconceptions thereof) mislead you. Educate yourself on the differences, understand why there are differences, understand which differences are due to cost control and corner cutting, and understand which differences are that of style, tradition, and history.

[Heming]

In the US you can get bovine or equine fur sporrans to mimic seal. Of course you can get those in Europe and Canada, too, they're usually a less expensive alternative.

[MacMillan of Rathdown]

In the US you can get bovine or equine fur sporrans to mimic seal. Of course you can get those in Europe and Canada, too, they're usually a less expensive alternative.

In an ideal world one does not take economic shortcuts, or accept "fake" instead of "real".

Since the OP asked for input about the "ideal" kilted wardrobe, ersatz substitutes were ignored.

[KFCarter]

Ok, you highland dress traditionalists out there -- I have an advice thread idea. I had given some thought to writing an article of sorts along these lines myself, but then I decided I would be more interested in hearing what the collected wisdom of this forum might come up with.....

1. The kilt itself.
IDEAL: 8 yd, knife pleat, strome wool in your tartan of choice, handsewn by a kiltmaker of choice, after an in-person consult for measurements, discussion of pleating options and at least a dram or three.
BUDGET: A semi-traditional PV kilt from USAKilts... traditional fit, good swish factor, the practicality of PV and Rocky's great service.

note: My daywear choices are designed for business use.

2. Shoes, daywear.
IDEAL: High quality brogues or oxfords, a black pair and a brown pair.
BUDGET: What you already have in the closet, polished.

3. Shoes, eveningwear.
IDEAL: Bespoke buckle shoes from DFWII, complemented by polished brogues or ghillie brogues for certain settings and levels of formality.
BUDGET: Highly polished brogues, or oxfords that you may already own for work.

4. Hose, daywear.
IDEAL: Lewis hose from Scottish Tartan Museum, paired with Traditional Garter Ties from the same place.
BUDGET: Stick with the Lewis hose... they're a great value and will last... making them a long-term value buy.

5. Hose, eveningwear.
IDEAL: Hand-knit Tartan hose to match your tartan, complemented by Argyll and Diced hose in suitable colors to handle varying levels of formality.
BUDGET: Hate to sound like a broken record, but dark colored Lewis Hose could pass muster.

6. Sporran, daywear.
IDEAL: I own it. A structured, two-toned, all-leather model from Janet Eagleton. I have a brown one, but it can be made in black/gray as well. It's just incredibly flexible and can be used for events that might call for a "semi-formal" sporran.
BUDGET: The Rob Roy Sporran from STA is a good looking daywear sporran for a great price and Buzz Kidder options are also good value

7. Sporran, eveningwear.
IDEAL: Sterling silver, engraved cantle, sealskin if legally obtained, fur if the former isn’t available.
BUDGET: Any number of chrome cantled, fur or bovine choices are available.

8. Jacket and/or waistcoat, daywear.
IDEAL: Bespoke Harris Tweed, plain cuffs, flat epaulets, or none at all... just beautiful cloth made to fit like a glove... heaven. Matching five button waistcoat
BUDGET: Charcoal "Crail" (more like a Braemar) and waistcoat available at Scottish Tartan Museum. Incredibly flexible, can dress up and down, and can work with any tartan.

9. Jacket and/or waistcoat, eveningwear.
IDEAL: Black Velvet or Barathea Doublet with bias cut tartan waistcoat, and also a waistcoat in matching black for some settings.
BUDGET: Black Barathea Argyll jacket with matching waistcoat... more flexible than a PC as it can be used for formal settings when paired with the right accessories, but also use in daywear settings as well.

10. (Because it has to be a round number), your one other piece of personal advice.

I listed a Budget choice in the kilt line-item for this reason: as much as it is true that saving for the 16 oz. Wool option is the best way to go, there could be some for whom that is impractical due to issues of timing or family responsibilities, etc. and those folks should know there are acceptable options for traditional use that are a bit more accessible.

[kiltedsawyer]

While I certainly don't consider myself, (nor does anyone else I'm sure,) an expert in these matters, my opinion varies I think from what I have read so far in this thread and I hope may be of some use to those wrestling with what to purchase.

Ideal items 1 through 9: Buy it from Matt.
Ideal item 10: Listen to Matt.

This is pretty easy, except when it comes to paying for it. I'm not saying it's overpriced, I'm certain that it is not, but for many it may be out of reach. That's okay, that's why there is a second part to this.

Budget

1. Kilt - Machine sewn, 8 yard, 16 oz. wool in what ever tartan or non-tartan suits your fancy. This may still be the most expensive part of your kit, but can be had for as little as $130.00 to $350.00 Only the experts can tell a handsewn kilt from a machine sewn kilt, so don't go near them, (the experts.) They're probably not as much fun at parties anyway.

2. Shoes-day wear - Anything but flip-flops unless you are at the beach in which case that 8 yd 16 oz kilt is going to be too warm anyway. Just be sure to match your leathers, i.e. shoes, belt, and sporran.

3. Shoes-evening - Good dress shoes, preferably lace-up, but the best you have. Again match your leathers. Black is preferable for evening wear. No need to buy special shoes, most of the ones they sell for uber-formal wear look silly and you wouldn't wear them with anything else anyway.

4. & 5. Hose: Get the best you can afford, but expect to pay $15.00 to $20.00 for hose that are thick enough to not let the color of your pasty white legs show through. Anything costing less will probably not do this unless your legs are twigs or not pasty white. Try to pick a color that matches one of the colors in your kilt.

6. Sporran - day wear- This is tough, there are a lot of cheap sporrans out there and most of them look about the same. My recommendation is to find someone who can work with leather, get a very simple handmade sporran, Rob Roy style is fine, and dress it up with some antler tips or a clan badge to personalize it.

7. Sporran - evening wear - I would recommend something in the semi-formal arena. This provides the most flexibility. Still, this can cost as much as your machine sewn kilt. Again, black is better for evening wear. You could go with a black semi-formal and only buy one sporran and use it as day wear as well. Watch e-bay for bargains and be patient. There are handmade sporrans of considerable quality on e-bay from time to time. Just don't bid against me. Don't worry about the uber-formal stuff unless you have a specific event in the near future. Even then, wear what you can afford and wear it proudly. Chances are that you'll be the only kilted person there anyway, (unless it's a Burns Supper,) so most people will be fascinated by the whole get-up and will know considerably less about it than you do.

8. & 9. Jacket / Waistcoat. Unless you are going to go kilted to every event for the rest of your life, (some members of this forum do and more power to them,) you can probably get away with one black Argyle Jacket and waistcoat. Again, you can find good quality new items on e-bay and spend considerably less than what many of the on-line and brick and mortar shops want for theirs. If you wear the waistcoat, you can save money by not buying a black belt, (if your daywear belt is brown.)

10. General advice: Don't be intimidated by those that have 27 kilts, 8 tweed jackets, 2 PCs and a doublet. Highland attire is fun, but what's the point in spending thousands of dollars on clothes that you will not wear all that often. The point is to buy the best you can afford, and be comfortable with it. You can always upgrade over time.