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Thread: Wannabe Scot

  1. #31
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    Quote Originally Posted by Graham
    and the other issue, I'm just saying that it's a shame that kilt wearing is often frowned upon in Scotland, and yet seems to be more acceptable in other countries, so any notion of "let's go to Scotland where the kilt is more accepted" would likely be a false one.
    So what you are saying is that you've set up your own notions of how Scotland is supposed to be and now you're disappointed and dismayed to find out that your own notions were incorrect.

  2. #32
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    [Yikes! I just logged on and got through to "X Marks...." immediately. That's the first time that has been possible for several days ]

    I do not wish to become too embroiled in this thread, but I have to say to both Daz and Ron, "Well said."

    Each one of us has a different take on our heritage and whether or not we consider The Kilt to be a significant part of it. Yes, I am proud of my Scottish blood as, indeed, I am of my English blood, but I cannot get worked up or defensive about what might have happened to my forefathers (or foremothers) on either side all those years ago. What is Scottish blood or English blood anyway? None of it is 100% pure. All those who went before me, at some time or another, were themselves invaded or invaders, maybe both - probably rapers and pillagers too, if the truth were to be known. I also have to ask myself, were those dastardly deeds of yesteryear any worse than the dastardly deeds being carried out by so-called civilized peoples of today - I very much doubt it.

    As for my kilt-wearing: to me my kilts are garments. Garments I choose to wear daily for their comfort and their unquestionable talent for being ultra-casual, ultra-smart and all the other 'ultras' in between. There are alternative garments I could wear, indeed I have worn them most of my life, but I now choose not to wear them because of their talent for discomfort. Respect? Oh, yes! I respect The Kilt, its past, its present and its future. I respect the tartans from which many of those kilts are tailored - and yes, I do wear certain tartans simply because I like them but they receive identical respect to that I show to my Clan Gunn tartans. My respect most obviously takes the form of taking the trouble always to look my tidiest and cleanest when kilted - no blatant or inappropriate sloganed T-shirts, no wildly patterned shirts but plain colours to compliment whichever tartan kilt I am wearing (plain ties following the same guidelines too), appropriate accessories, clean shoes or boots ...... the list goes on and on. That to me is showing respect.

    Ok. That's it. I have said far more than I intended, but I needed to express my opinions here. That's now done, so ......
    [B][I][U]No. of Kilts[/U][/I][/B][I]:[/I] 102.[I] [B]"[U][B]Title[/B]"[/U][/B][/I]: Lord Hamish Bicknell, Laird of Lochaber / [B][U][I]Life Member:[/I][/U][/B] The Scottish Tartans Authority / [B][U][I]Life Member:[/I][/U][/B] The Royal Scottish Country Dance Society / [U][I][B]Member:[/B][/I][/U] The Ardbeg Committee / [I][B][U]My NEW Photo Album[/U]: [/B][/I][COLOR=purple]Sadly, and with great regret, it seems my extensive and comprehensive album may now have been lost forever![/COLOR]/

  3. #33
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    I've decided to restore this thread and move it here, to the Off Topic section.

    There are multiple issues in this thread that we can continue to address and the removal of the thread was not going to allow some of those discussions to continue.

    Graham, I hope you see where I am coming from, by restoring this one.

    I am of the opinion that there are far too many people that want to embrace the Scots nature of kilt-wearing, but are not willing to invest any time in learning anything about Scotland, herself.

    There are others here that are discussing what is behind their own desire to wear a kilt, whether it is to be make a fashion statement, to simply be comfortable or to celebrate their heritage.

    There are others that want to wear the kilt on a daily basis, while there are others that do not. The freedoms to make those decisions presents yet another topic for discussion.

    As I mentioned, there are too many topics to simple erase all of them from the forum, by deleting a single thread.

    OK, for those that embrace the Scots background of the kilt, here is a little quiz to test your knowledge. I mentioned some pals of mine commemorating the Battle of Sheriffmuir, by retracing Mar's route to the battlefield.

    Here's a little hint - I was referring to the 6th Earl of Mar.

    1. What was the 6th Earl of Mar's name?
    2. What was the outcome of the Battle of Sheriffmuir? Who won that battle?
    3. The 6th Earl of Mar had a nickname. What was it and how did he come by it?
    4. What geographical feature did Mar create in Clackmannanshire, that still exists today?

    Some ground rules - Daz, you are disqualified, no 'ringers' allowed. ;) Secondly, no search engines to discover the answers. If you have the answers, post them. If you don't have the answers, then let's spend a bit of time learning some background on Scotland.

  4. #34
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    Good point Mike,

    I have over two dozen books on Scotland, Scottish history, and things Scottish and I'M STILL CONFUSED! A tough study even for one of the blood.

    Now ask me about War 2 and I'm there...or the War Between the States....I'm there.

    One of the things I enjoy about this board is learning more Scottish history and learning to sort it all out better.

    Ron
    Ol' Macdonald himself, a proud son of Skye and Cape Breton Island
    Lifetime Member STA. Two time winner of Utilikiltarian of the Month.
    "I'll have a kilt please, a nice hand sewn tartan, 16 ounce Strome. Oh, and a sporran on the side, with a strap please."

  5. #35
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    Ron, that is another aspect of this thread. It is obvious that you have spent time researching and coming to understand the Navajo and their culture, or you'd never been invited into that sweat lodge. As such, I would tend to think that you would be much better qualified to comment on the Navajo ways of life than someone that had spent little to no time in that same type of research.

    My point (I'm coming to it, really I am ;) ) is that we need to understand a bit more about subjects that we are going to discuss.

    And, no matter the reasoning behind it, since this forum identifies with Scotland, why not learn a little bit about her, instead of making broad generalizations that are quite often incorrect? Far too often, people think of Scotland and they can only visualize hundreds of men, all dressed in the kilt with woad on their faces and swinging claymores about their heads. They don't see Scotland for what she is, an incredible country with tremendous resources and a culture that is one of the most rich in the world.

    I'm going out on a limb here, but I am betting that Daz has never used woad on his face. (Daz, if you have, it's bound to be a story worthy of its own thread! )

    The 'fashion horses' may not want to participate in this type of discussion, but there may be those that will appreciate being able to actually learn something and put some of the myths to rest.

    So ;), did you want to give me any answers about Mar?

    And Todd, you just hush, you hear?!? ;)

  6. #36
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    Solid point Mike,

    As much as I've read about the Navajo, as much as I've learned first hand about the Navajo, even being recruited and hired to work for the Navajo Nation, being invited to participate in many sweat lodges and other Traditional ceremonies, and taking Converstaional Navajo at the local college from a Native speaker, I still know didly squat compared to the Navajo people who live the life.

    I do know much more than the average non-Navajo....but it pales in the face of reality.

    Scottish culture is much more distant geographically, I'm not immersed in it daily as I am Navajo culture...would guess no matter how much I studied, how often I visited Scotland (still a dream), I still won't "get it." My closest tie to Scotland was my grandfather Murdoch who still spoke with a brogue and taught me what Campbells did to Macdonalds. A wee window.

    Ron
    Ol' Macdonald himself, a proud son of Skye and Cape Breton Island
    Lifetime Member STA. Two time winner of Utilikiltarian of the Month.
    "I'll have a kilt please, a nice hand sewn tartan, 16 ounce Strome. Oh, and a sporran on the side, with a strap please."

  7. #37
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    Quote Originally Posted by Mike1
    I've decided to restore this thread and move it here, to the Off Topic section.

    There are multiple issues in this thread that we can continue to address and the removal of the thread was not going to allow some of those discussions to continue.

    Graham, I hope you see where I am coming from, by restoring this one.

    I am of the opinion that there are far too many people that want to embrace the Scots nature of kilt-wearing, but are not willing to invest any time in learning anything about Scotland, herself.

    There are others here that are discussing what is behind their own desire to wear a kilt, whether it is to be make a fashion statement, to simply be comfortable or to celebrate their heritage.

    There are others that want to wear the kilt on a daily basis, while there are others that do not. The freedoms to make those decisions presents yet another topic for discussion.

    As I mentioned, there are too many topics to simple erase all of them from the forum, by deleting a single thread.

    OK, for those that embrace the Scots background of the kilt, here is a little quiz to test your knowledge. I mentioned some pals of mine commemorating the Battle of Sheriffmuir, by retracing Mar's route to the battlefield.

    Here's a little hint - I was referring to the 6th Earl of Mar.

    1. What was the 6th Earl of Mar's name?
    2. What was the outcome of the Battle of Sheriffmuir? Who won that battle?
    3. The 6th Earl of Mar had a nickname. What was it and how did he come by it?
    4. What geographical feature did Mar create in Clackmannanshire, that still exists today?

    Some ground rules - Daz, you are disqualified, no 'ringers' allowed. ;) Secondly, no search engines to discover the answers. If you have the answers, post them. If you don't have the answers, then let's spend a bit of time learning some background on Scotland.
    1. John Erskine
    2. The Jacobites lost the battle.
    3. Bobbing John
    4. I haven't the slightest idea, but would like to know.

    However, back to the conversation at hand. I come from two heritages, one Scottish and one Dutch. I am an American by birth and will die an American. That said, I try to honor both of my backgrounds. I wear the kilt, when I can, not all the time but when I can. I am no less a Scot for that. I wear my kippa, when it is appropriate. Am I less a Jew for not wearing it all the time. I think not.

    We will all disagree over somethings, the true showing of our character is how we deal with the disagreement.

    Sorry for the diatribe, I just had to add my nickels worth!

  8. #38
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    No problem Mike, removing the whole post was an accident, late night and a dram can do that!

  9. #39
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    instead of woad- i used kids blue face paint at a rugby match several years ago Ill try nd find a pic

  10. #40
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    Quote Originally Posted by ByDand
    1. John Erskine
    Correct

    2. The Jacobites lost the battle.
    Are you sure on that count? ;)

    3. Bobbing John
    The 1/2 of the question you answered is correct. Why was he called Bobbing John?

    4. I haven't the slightest idea, but would like to know.
    Look HERE for your answer.

    In about a year's time, I plan to be living on the street that dead-ends at the park. I'll be across there in about 16 days time and plan to take a walk up to the park, which is only 7-8 minutes away from the house. If you climb the hill, just inside the park, and look back to the West, you can see the Wallace Monument -



    Looking to the South, across Alloa (John Erskine's birthplace) to Kincardine -


    So, how about it? Do we want to share some educational posts on Scotland, or no?

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