X Marks tartan at Fraser & Kirkbright

[mkmound]

Ron has a good idea. This cloth may not be suitable for kilts, but this may be the perfect opportunity for those who have X Marks kilts (or will be getting X Marks kilts with the next fabric run) to get some fabric for some accessories. Remember, this cloth is not normally available unless a bulk order is put in. So here is your perfect opportunity to get some cloth for...

A vest, as Ron has mentioned....
A fly plaid....
A sash for the wife....
A scarf....
A pair of traditional cadadh hose...
An "X Marks the Scot" tartan banner for parading or flying at your clan tent....

Lots of opportunities!
Matt

Hmmmmm . . . . . . so could someone provide dimensions and yardage estimates for these items? (taking into account the loss of the damaged selvedge edges)

E.g.,

• vest . . . 1 yd / m
• sash . . . 15 in. x 90 in. = 2.5 yds normally yields four 15 in. widths, minus 1 for the damage = 4 sashes
• fly plaid . . .
• flag . . . typical size??

Thanks!!

[M. A. C. Newsome]

Fly plaids can vary in size, but from most suppliers will be 40" x 40." I've made them larger on request for some cusomters.

Sashes are typially 10" to 12" wide and 90" long. Scarves are typically 10" to 12" wide and 54" long.

A flag is usually 3' x 5' which equates to 36" x 54". So one yard of cloth will suffice.

A two yard length fringed on all four edges would make a lovely shawl!

Matt

[mkmound]

Steve,

Thanks for the detailed assessment of the goods. Some questions . . .

. . .

This is the damaged fabric that I rejected. It is my opinion that the Selvedge is totally unusable. (Please see the pics in the thread referanced above.) In many places the damage extends greater than 2" into the selvedge edges. Where we originally hoped to find usable lengths I later found small rips in the opposite edge.
. . .

So anyone planning to use this would need to plan to lose 2" on both edges. Given 59" wide fabric, that leaves 55" usable, right?

. . .
There are also oil and grease spots on many areas from what I assume was the bearing that failed on the finishing machine.
The entire two rolls have internal stresses that can be seen when you lay the fabric out flat. The Tartan pattern is not straight and there are ripples and bulges that won't lay flat.

. . .

Do you think that the oil and grease could be cleaned? By washing with a good grease remover, or by dry cleaning?

Are the internal stresses such that after cleaning and pressing, could they be flattened out with the pressing?

. . .
It is only my opinion but I would not use this fabric for a kilt. Not a kilt of any kind except perhaps a mini cheerleader kilt that is made of small pieces. It is perfectly suited for almost any other use you can think of. Vests, ties, flashes, linings, sporrans, car seat cushions, your cat's bed, almost anything but a kilt.

. . .

So potentially suitable for anything which will be hemmed or fringed?

One other thought on this . . . and it is an opinion with which others are certainly free to disagree . . . my view is that this is a special tartan for our "on-line" clan, and it seems wrong somehow (to me) to use it for some use like car seeat cushions or a cat's bed.

Also, if used for a flag, is the weave strong enough to withstand being whipped by the wind, assuming that the edges were properly bound? Would it need to be bonded to something stronger, or maybe two layers bonded together (iron-on interfacing, etc., ?) to withstand the weather?

Just my rambling thoughts . . .

Mark

[ccga3359]

One other thought on this . . . and it is an opinion with which others are certainly free to disagree . . . my view is that this is a special tartan for our "on-line" clan, and it seems wrong somehow (to me) to use it for some use like car seeat cushions or a cat's bed.

So much for exclusivity to XMarks only. This is being offered to the general public after all.

[The Wizard of BC]

OK,OK. My saying that the Tartan could be used for car seats and cat beds was only my warped sense of humor!!!!!!!!
I was not serious. I can think of many suitable uses for this fabric and just as Matt said it would be perfect for fly plaids, scarves, and shawls.

I'm a kiltmaker and had to assess the fabric for it's intended use because that is what our members asked me to do. Yes, I could have held on to the fabric and attempted to sell it in pieces to members who wish to make shawls but I've got kilts to make and Gordon needs to get his money back for it. It was decided that this was the best way. It is his fabric. I rejected it and did not pay for it.

Yes, some non X Marks person could buy some of the fabric but I doubt that there are going to be a flood of X Marks kilts suddenly show up on e-bay.
And if the members hurry and buy it all for small projects it will still be exclusive to us. So pony up and call Gordon.

To answer the questions - --

One roll of the fabric I cut in half trying to get usable lengths, but the other roll is still full width, so yes, a 54-55 inch wide piece is available from Gordon.

It may be possible to clean the fabric. I did not try.

The stressing of the fabric did pull on the yarns and there are bulges. I did not try to steam it to get it to lay flat. But if the fabric is used for small projects it should not be noticable.

Yes, the fabric is very suitable for any project that will be hemmed or fringed or sewn into something which does not rely on the fabric hanging straight as in a kilt.

If used for a flag or banner and the edges were hemmed or bound it should be perfectly ok.

Guys, this is really good 16oz. fabric. The weaving of this is far better than the previous runs. If it had not been for the finisher screwing it up, I think everyone would have been very happy with it and it would have made beautiful kilts.

Gordon has be perfectly up front about this. He notified us immediately upon finding the damage. He offered to replace it out of his own pocket. The only reason he sent it over to me was in a hope that I could find some usable kilt lengths and get our members who ordered and paid for it their fabric.
Now the man is out a ton of money. He has this fabric that he needs to sell as remnants, so lets help him out.

[mkmound]

Steve,

Thanks for patiently answering all of my questions . . . I wasn't trying to be a pain, but I'm sure I was anyway. Ron's and Matt's posts started the wheels turning, and I wanted to understand as much as possible about what I (or someone) might be getting into if using the yardage; I feel like I need to ask all the questions I can think of, since I don't really sew myself (yet, anyway). So thanks again for the answers . . . you're the only one from XMarts who's seen the condition of the fabric, as far as I know. I agree that this is good fabric, and it's a good deal -- as long as the buyer understands the limitations, so I'm trying to figure out what I might use some for.

Also, you mentioned that Gordon had been up front about the damage, etc. I do remember you stressing that on the other posts about the order, and every impression I've had of your dealings with him have been favorable. If I implied anything about him not handling this correctly, it was completely unintentional. From everything you've posted here, he's a first class manufacturer / merchant, and I have no reason to believe otherwise.

On to more practical matters . . .

Matt (or others who have tailored vests / waistcoats) -- how much yardage would it take to make a vest with the tartan on the diagonal?

Steve -- do you happen to have scraps left from the second run (which is what my kilts is from) -- how well do / might the colors match to be able to wear a vest from the damaged run with a kitl from the second run?

Also . . . you mentioned that you cut one roll of fabric in half . . . lengthwise, or you cut a full-width piece from half of the roll? In other words, is it two 30m lengths of single width from that roll, or two 15m lengths of double width? (Assumption: since there are 60m total, there are two 30m rolls.)

Thanks,
Mark

[scoutniagara]

I'll await the next run of XMarks tartan. By then, I'll have my CCK Maple Leaf, my SWK black shadow and ???

[M. A. C. Newsome]

So much for exclusivity to XMarks only. This is being offered to the general public after all.

Um, was this tartan ever supposed to be "exclusive" to X Marks members? I designed the tartan, and I don't recall this being the case.

In fact, when Nick Fiddes posted on this board about his new tartan finder for kiltstore.net, there were more than a few members complaining that they couldn't find the X Marks tartan listed there (I don't think it has ever been added). But the point being if the tartan gets listed on kiltstore.net, it's there for anyone to buy.

And anyone can buy it anyway. I've never put any restrictions on the tartan, as the designer, and pretty much gave the design to Hank to do with what he will for the forum. As far as I know he's never put any restrictions on it, either. That means anybody could call up me, or Kathy Lare, of Barb, or "Jimmy the kiltmaker" and ask to have a kilt in the X Marks tartan and it could be woven and made for you.

And really, how many thousands of people are registered with this forum? And how many lurkers are there who don't register? How on earth would we limit the tartan to forum mebers even if we wanted to?

Seeing as the great bulk of posters to this forum preach that you can "wear whatever tartan you like, so long as you do it with respect" (try searching for any thread on this topic), I think the same should apply to non-X Marks members, that they can also wear whatever tartan they choose, including the X Marks tartan!

In any case, my main point here is that the X Marks tartan, to my knowledge, was never intended to be a "restricted" tartan at all.

Matt

[ccga3359]

Exclusive? Yes. Restricted? No. This is a public forum after all. I am assuming that there have only been three runs of this material and have been purchased through XMarks. I agree that if anyone had the money to produce their own run of this tartan, that they could. Failing that they would have to wait for an XMarks run and post that they wanted some. In order to post on XMarks one had to sign up, correct? Doesn't this simple fact made it "exclusive" to us?

[Tartan Hiker]

Shameless bump.

I'm still so tempted to order two yards and make a box-pleat with it.