A question regarding a clan badge

[Bugbear]

Mornin' Ted!

Clansman's badges are jewelry in the same way that a silver circlet set with agate or caringom and worn on the bonnet is jewelry. To be sure they have a familial significance, and are governed by rules concerning pattern and shape, but they are items of jewelry none the less.

Because this is X Marks the Scot, not X Marks the Sumpthenelz, I think it is reasonable (and laudable on your part) to play by the rules. That said, strictly speaking the rules only apply to Scots and Clanfolk. Those outside the tartan tent have a bit more latitude in "bonnet jewelry".

Whimsy is something all to often overlooked, and if things are done within the "spirit" of the rules then there is no reason why a fella can't have a bit of fun.

Lots of non-Scottish, non-clan affiliated individuals and organizations use the buckle and strap devise, usually associated with the clansman's badge, and there is no reason why you could not do the same. Your friends would know what you are doing, and if you pitched up at a highland games 99% of those attending would just assume it was a "clan badge" and let it go at that-- if anyone asked, and one or two might-- you fill them in and go on your merry way.

So, for my money, there is nothing wrong, inherently evil, immoral, or evening fattening, about the individual use of the "buckle and strap". I would, however, speak out against the use of a circlet surrounding a devise as that is a heraldic item unique to an armiger.

Anyhow, what were you thinking of doing?

Cheers!
Scott

Thank you. In part, I was just looking through things I already have to see if something could be adapted to a badge. It seems like the circlet would rule out just about all coins or coin-like tokens.

The other thought was to put a symbol or depiction of something I am connected to on a disk of the right size. It seems like other members are using all kinds of things for cap badges.
Thanks everybody for your help.

[svc40bt]

The downside, if there is one, is that at a distance of even a few feet your "light weight" USMC cap badge looks very much like the circlet used to surround the crest of an armiger.

I would be curious what kilts thescot wears this badge with? If for instance with the Leatherneck tartan, one might expect it to be USMC related; if with a clan tartan then I would take your point, though I would hope any gentleman who had possible exception to it would take the time to discern that it was in fact no way clan related (other than US Marines being a rather clannish group) and thus that no disrepect was intended.

A related question, as I know little of heraldry. Would one be guilty of anything other than poor taste and disrespect of tradition if they were to wear a plain circlet cap badge or use another's arms in the US? I gather that there are some criminal or civil penalties for doing so in Scotland? Please note that I have no intentions of doing so, in fact I own neither bonnet nor badge, but am just curious if there is any protection for heraldic items from other nations in the US.

[JSFMACLJR]

I
A related question, as I know little of heraldry. Would one be guilty of anything other than poor taste and disrespect of tradition if they were to wear a plain circlet cap badge or use another's arms in the US? I gather that there are some criminal or civil penalties for doing so in Scotland? Please note that I have no intentions of doing so, in fact I own neither bonnet nor badge, but am just curious if there is any protection for heraldic items from other nations in the US.

No, just poor taste and a total disregard of tradition. You might get an earful from someone about this breach; other than that, you won't be hauled off to HM Gaol!

[svc40bt]

No, just poor taste and a total disregard of tradition. You might get an earful from someone about this breach; other than that, you won't be hauled off to HM Gaol!

So, how about in the UK?

[MacMillan of Rathdown]

I would be curious what kilts thescot wears this badge with? If for instance with the Leatherneck tartan, one might expect it to be USMC related;

most people can not recognize any tartan but their own-- they honestly wouldn't know the difference between Leatherneck and Lamont. Those who know something of heraldry would see the badge and think "armiger", without regard for the clan/tartan connection.

...if with a clan tartan then I would take your point, though I would hope any gentleman who had possible exception to it would take the time to discern that it was in fact no way clan related (other than US Marines being a rather clannish group) and thus that no disrepect was intended.

Some might inquire, but the vast majority would not. I think most people would arch an eyebrow, and shrug. A few might say, "ooh", and that would be about it.

A related question, as I know little of heraldry. Would one be guilty of anything other than poor taste and disrespect of tradition if they were to wear a plain circlet cap badge or use another's arms in the US? I gather that there are some criminal or civil penalties for doing so in Scotland? Please note that I have no intentions of doing so, in fact I own neither bonnet nor badge, but am just curious if there is any protection for heraldic items from other nations in the US.

In the USA the use of another person's arms would probably be the legal equivalent of putting a Mercedes Benz star on a kit car, although it would be up to the aggrieved armiger to seek redress through the civil courts. The armiger might have recourse through the criminal courts as he could conceivably claim "identity theft", but I think that would be a bit of a reach.

As the Scottish courts have no jurisdiction in the USA, I doubt someone passing themselves off as an armiger could expect a call from the Procurtor Fiscal of the Court of the Lord Lyon. As an aside, in Scotland foreign armigers, unless resident in Scotland, are exempt for the jurisdiction of Lyon Court. Once they take up residence then they are expected to register their arms and follow Scots law as it appertains to the use of heraldry.

[MacMillan of Rathdown]

Thank you. In part, I was just looking through things I already have to see if something could be adapted to a badge. It seems like the circlet would rule out just about all coins or coin-like tokens.

If you were to place a coin in some sort of circular frame, it wouldn't look like the "crest" within a "circlet" that identifies an armiger, so there wouldn't be any sort of heraldic "problem".

The other thought was to put a symbol or depiction of something I am connected to on a disk of the right size. It seems like other members are using all kinds of things for cap badges.
Thanks everybody for your help.

Generally speaking a more-or-less sold disc wouldn't be confused with the circlet. What would cause confusion would be if the disc was open in the centre, with some sort of device in the middle that, to the casual observer, would look like a "crest".

Placing a gold USMC EGA on a red disc (with or without "Sempre Fi" along the edge of the disc) doesn't transgress any heraldic regulation as it obviously isn't a crest. But, if you put the EGA inside a circlet (that is a disc which is open in the centre) then you have created a "look-alike" situation, and that should be avoided.

[Bugbear]

Thank youfor explaining that, MacMillan of Rathdown.