Montrose Doublet

[AFS1970]

Is cutting down a cassock just to get a certain style of opening? I think the over all look would be really that of a slightly fancier clerical shirt and not that of a jacket. I think the shoulder cape might be a bit of overkill in anything but the most traditional settings.

The biretta seems a bit out of place in highland wear, if only because I rarely see it worn as a non ceremonial item of dress these days, despite it's roots as an academic hat. Most denominations that wear them do so generally with other vestments or choir dress both of which would tend to cover up the kilt. Although the trouble maker in me is thinking if one could be diced? Although the red pom at the top might lead some to confuse you with an Arch Deacon or Monsignor.

While writing this another thought came up, of using the simple cloth buttons common on cassocks for a montrose, to give it a plain but still fancy look. That lead me to wonder if one could be made with interchangeable buttons, metal for formal and cloth for informal wear. This might end up with something similar to the idea of cutting down the cassock.

[davidg]

Another idea I have played with is cutting a cassock down to normal shirt length to wear with a kilt, cassock shoulder cape, and biretta. Of course, it would be an Anglican style, wool cassock (as opposed to a Roman style with the bottons down the center front). Do either of you (David and Bill) think that could work properly?

BTW, I guess we speak to what we are used to. My cassock has a collar opening of only two inches, but David is quite correct in stating the opening can be up to 4".

I'm not comfortable with this idea as I don't think it would look right, not the way you are describing it anyway, and that it would therefore not work

A modern clerical shirt already is, effectively, a cut down cassock as is a clerical waistcoat and the Anglican "Apron". In relation to these items your cut down cassock would actually be a backward step historically

The collar gap has, as far as I am aware, never been fixed at anything. Cassocks made in Rome or intended for Roman priests and bishops often tend to have a smaller gap. Cassocks in the UK tend towards having a wider gap because they are aimed primarily at Church of England and Church of Scotland clerics. That does not make for an "official policy" but rather that Roman priests tend to buy more from Roman suppliers because of their often frequent trips to that city and Roman shops simply cut a smaller gap

Incidentally, Wippells call your Roman cassock a "Latin" cassock and it is quite popular with many Church of England clerics because it is a traditional style. Personally I prefer Roman or Latin to the double breasted Sarum which does not hang right on me. Fortunately, though, I rarely need to wear one

What may look better, although I do have one and prefer not to wear it, is a clerical vest made in black barathea (to match an Argyll or PC etc) and which fastens up the front with 7 silver Lion Rampant buttons. I'm not sure why I do not like it but equally I do not like to see a standard 5 button waistcoat with the clerical shirt either although I think the 3 button PC vest looks fine. That's probably just down to my strange tastes and eccentricity

[Father Bill]

Hey - I'm Anglican, and my widest notch is 3/4" because that's what I like.

I wouldn't be too big on cutting down a cassock - a nice one is both too expensive and too heavy to cut down and wear as a shirt, and a cheaper lighter one is... well... cheaper.

[creagdhubh]

I agree whold heartedly. And that's the way I wear my Montrose.

But for his clerical look, i kind of like his plain collar and tabs.

Agreed.