The Boars are back !!

[dfmacliam]

Yeah... I dunno about Tennessee, but here in Georgia there is no season and no limit for hunting feral hogs- they're considered a virtual blight. I'm not sure they are the same thing as a wild BOAR, but certainly close enough.

Boars and feral hogs are the same thing.. until the Spanish set foot upon this continent, there were no pigs, or boars living in the wild.. they were an introduced species, much like the horse..

Now there is one exception to the rule.. and that is the javelina or peccary..

Peccaries (also known as javelinas, by the Portuguese name javali and Spanish jabalí or pecarí) are medium-sized mammals of the family Tayassuidae. Peccaries are members of the artiodactyl suborder Suina, as are swine (Suidae) and possibly hippopotami.[1] They are found in the southwestern area of North America and throughout Central and South America. Peccaries usually measure between 90 to 130 centimetres (3.0 to 4.3 ft), and a full-grown adult usually weighs between about 20 to 40 kilograms (44 to 88 lb).

People often confuse peccaries, which are found in the Americas, with pigs which originated in Afro-Eurasia, especially since some domestic pigs brought by European settlers have escaped over the years and now run wild as razorback hogs in many parts of the United States.

these last two paragraphs were copied from wikipedia.

[English Bloke]

... It would be a great mistake to ignore, underestimate, or scorn the outside money, past and present, spent on sporting activities ... that have and still do help many estates provide much needed income and employment for the local population.

When the farm-gate price of a litre of milk is less than the production cost, farmers have to attract income by any means to stay afloat. As Jock states, it's vital for local economies to be self sufficient.

Farming is dying in this country (Britain generally I mean) in the same way that coal mining, fishing, ship building and car manufacture already have. If we are not very careful we'll impose so many obstacles on our farming communities regarding how they can and can't manage the land they work that they will all be gone before long. Then we'll be importing ALL our beef from Argentina and our milk from Poland (as well as our bloody coal.)

I share your sentiment about the hazards to indigenous species from idiots with guns but there is now legislation and heavy penalties in place to protect the majority of the ones you list Phil... Incidentally the biggest threat to Badgers isn't the posh folk, it's Neds/Chavs with dogs...

If I was a farmer and some toff in a red jacket wanted to pay me for the privilage of riding his horses through my field or blast my farmed grouse and pheasants from the sky I'd bank it. It means I can produce more loss making milk and put more Angus on restaurant plates.

[dfmacliam]

In Texas, its becoming an industry.. wild game hunts.. people have opened their ranches, game.. I have seen African Antelope, deer of a multitude of species, elk, buffalo (bison), ect.. LOL.. with the ferral hogs.. farmers, in the past have encouraged hunters to come in a help control the population.. now I am actually seeing farmers charging hunters to come in and take hogs.. even when they are still a nuisence.. just another way of cashing in, on those who wll spend mony to shoot animals...

I feel with proper management, the animals can be returned to the wild, or managed properties, and still provide a source of income for the continued management and the local economy. Everyone wins.. if they approach it with a realistic goal, and proper management

[English Bloke]

... Everyone wins.. if they approach it with a realistic goal, and proper management..

Hear hear!

[Jock Scot]

your true to a extent but can those locals children who are between 18-30 buy a house that some tourist has bought for the odd visit to hunt or stalk ...chances are no most tend to move to the city's to survive ,alot of the students in the unis and college`s are from the estates that you speak of unless its a estate job which many tend not to want they are kinda trapped in the central belt ,i know this from experience as every course Ive taken in any glasgow college 70% of the class dont come from central scotland at all even my own great grandfather had to move from kirkhill to coatbridge just to find a job my grandmother would speak of how much he missed Inverness-shire and its surrounding regions how he would always try visit when he could the only job that was on offer was estate work something he didn't want as his father and his fathers father did estate based work and he was adamant he wasn't going to follow there footsteps ended up he lied about his age to join the army to get away from the trappings of estate life im wondering is kirkhill farm anywhere near your home area jock? i know my great granddad was born on that very farm

No I do not know Kirkhill farm what part of Inverness-shire is it in? The local youngsters still cannot buy a house in the highlands, in truth most of them never could and probably that is how it is going to stay.It is a problem that haunts the rural community throughout the UK. I look at the 800 or so children going to the Lochaber High School in Fort William and wonder what local employment there will be for them and of course the answer is not very hopeful.It has always been the same, only these days the local "big estates" in these harsh economic times can help even less than they used to. What usually happens and this has gone on for at least 100 years, is that the cleaver ones leave the area to make their fortune and then retire back to the area.Generally speaking it is they, that are buying the properties up here and not the English.

[Phil]

It has always been the same, only these days the local "big estates" in these harsh economic times can help even less than they used to. What usually happens and this has gone on for at least 100 years, is that the cleaver ones leave the area to make their fortune and then retire back to the area.Generally speaking it is they, that are buying the properties up here and not the English.

As Jock says, the migration from the land is nothing new, nor is it limited only to the Highlands and Islands. I would disagree, however, that the big estates "can help" as they have never been run as philanthropic ventures. Jobs there have been at the whim of the owners and when estates have changed hands the loyal staff are usually the first to get the sack. Skauwt's great grandfather would probably have experienced this job insecurity and chosen a more certain future for him and his family in the urban south. It is interesting, Jock, that you have chosen to mention the "E" word in connection with incomers buying up properties but rather than get involved in a xenophobic discussion I think we should stick to the large swathes of Scotland owned by mostly absentee landlords. I know those of the English persuasion such as the Vesteys and the Duke of Westminster own huge tracts but so also do (or did) the likes of Mr Al-Fayed of Harrods fame (and Princess Diana infamy), the Dutch owner of the Makro stores, no doubt some Arab sheikhs etc. all of whom can be found here - http://www.whoownsscotland.org.uk/index.php so it is incorrect to lay the blame at any one door.

[Jock Scot]

As Jock says, the migration from the land is nothing new, nor is it limited only to the Highlands and Islands. I would disagree, however, that the big estates "can help" as they have never been run as philanthropic ventures. Jobs there have been at the whim of the owners and when estates have changed hands the loyal staff are usually the first to get the sack. Skauwt's great grandfather would probably have experienced this job insecurity and chosen a more certain future for him and his family in the urban south. It is interesting, Jock, that you have chosen to mention the "E" word in connection with incomers buying up properties but rather than get involved in a xenophobic discussion I think we should stick to the large swathes of Scotland owned by mostly absentee landlords. I know those of the English persuasion such as the Vesteys and the Duke of Westminster own huge tracts but so also do (or did) the likes of Mr Al-Fayed of Harrods fame (and Princess Diana infamy), the Dutch owner of the Makro stores, no doubt some Arab sheikhs etc. all of whom can be found here - http://www.whoownsscotland.org.uk/index.php so it is incorrect to lay the blame at any one door.

Oh come on Phil!It does not matter whether the money came from a Victorian arms manufacturer from Sheffield, or a modern day Russian oligarch the money that was and still is brought into rural Scotland was and still is sorely needed and rural Scotland without it would not be the place it is now.Not perfect by any means, but considerably better than it might be.Don't forget that many of the resident Scots landed families hardly covered themselves with glory during the clearances.Without doubt rural Scotland has benefited hugely from outside money and it still will in the future.Apart from private money being pumped into the rural areas, don't forget the various governments have also been doing the same too and the Caledonian canal and the Forestry Commission are two such examples.Could things have been done better or differently, well maybe,but in many ways rural Scotland would have been an even more of a sad place without outside money.

[Phil]

Oh come on Phil!It does not matter whether the money came from a Victorian arms manufacturer from Sheffield, or a modern day Russian oligarch the money that was and still is brought into rural Scotland was and still is sorely needed and rural Scotland without it would not be the place it is now.

I am sorry, Jock, if that is the impression I gave because it was not my intention. The point I was trying to make was the insecurity of the types of work offered by these estates, regardless of where their owners originated. And the situation becomes even worse when it is a syndicate that is involved where the management is transitory in the extreme. I appreciate where you are coming from, Jock, and I am sure that you are one of the (very) few who run their properties with beneficial paternalism, showering bountiful munificence upon their employees and who are able to sleep soundly as a result. Sadly not all are of that ilk and when any of the few jobs available are lost for reasons ranging from financial necessity to simply not liking someone's face, then, because a tied house is invariably involved, a whole family becomes dispossessed of their living and a roof over their heads.

[Jock Scot]

I am sorry, Jock, if that is the impression I gave because it was not my intention. The point I was trying to make was the insecurity of the types of work offered by these estates, regardless of where their owners originated. And the situation becomes even worse when it is a syndicate that is involved where the management is transitory in the extreme. I appreciate where you are coming from, Jock, and I am sure that you are one of the (very) few who run their properties with beneficial paternalism, showering bountiful munificence upon their employees and who are able to sleep soundly as a result. Sadly not all are of that ilk and when any of the few jobs available are lost for reasons ranging from financial necessity to simply not liking someone's face, then, because a tied house is invariably involved, a whole family becomes dispossessed of their living and a roof over their heads.

In the past I have had to make difficult commercial decisions that have affected individuals and their families and it it makes no difference if I had been running a ship building enterprise,coal mine or an estate, those commercial decisions would still have had to be made, for the greater good. Just like the people who own Johnny Walker whisky are having to make at this very moment.Make no mistake, my families' interests did(I am now retired) come first and foremost,as they must, but I would like to think that others have benefited along the way and I am proud to say that no one has been dispossessed on this estate,apart from my Grandfather by the War Office in 1939,for over a hundred years. Whilst some estates have gained a harsh reputation over the years, generally speaking I really do think that absentee landlords and estate owners in general are not given the credit they deserve for their contribution to the local economy.

[Bugbear]

I think I'll cook a ham.