It isn’t a skirt it is a kilt

[Jock Scot]

Sir, almost from the beginning of email on the 300 baud internet there has grown a educate on tone and context in emails. That many of the new comers to this media have failed to learn and consider it is unimportant, it still exists.

As in post number 19 where the poster grew up in Scotland and around kilts know what he is talking about, those of us who have been using the internet from almost the beginning understand email and forum post educate and how emphasis, word choice and context convey tone and intend. When that is included with a posters body of posts across the entire forum anger, offense and the intent to offend can be easily seen. IMHO and I have learned that with my opinion and $5.00 (US) you can buy a dollar cup of coffee.

OK as I am responsible for post 19, I seem to have inadvertantly caused you some offence for which I aplogise.

However, as a self taught and self confessed "technodunce" I am unaware of the internet niceties that, I think, you are speaking of. So again, please accept my apologies if I have gone beyond internet protocol.

I have to admit that I don't know what" 300 baud internet" nor "a educate on tone" is, or " know" (should it be knows?),or "understand email and forum post educate ", or "tone intend" means. And for that I apologise too, but is this technospeak? It is certainly not English English and perhaps therein lies our problem?

Regardless of the above,I have never intended "anger", "offense" or "intent to offend" and if you have taken it that way then again I am sorry.

I do wonder if we have another example of a "common language divided by ..........(the rest of the quotation slips my mind for the moment)thing, added to lack of my knowledge of internet protocol causing you such angst? I have to say whilst others from your side of the Atlantic do have problems with plain English which seems rather too plain for many North American ears, you do seem to have picked up unintended meanings. You may be interested to know that what I say would not cause a jot of upset here. But there we go.

So what is it exactly that have I said , in post 19, that is causing you such upset?

[tundramanq]

Jock this paragraph, Is the one I find offensive and I don't offend easily:

I say this as kindly as I can. It is you chaps from afar that have problems with this, not us. I suppose its to do with your culture being watered down by other cultures and by time and distance and of course if you choose to wear the kilt "out there" you are bound to stand out and thus catch the eye of those that might mock.

To reverse the perspective - as an example only - How about if I said you were part of an isolated inbred cult who has expelled those who think differently for centuries.
The first sentence you preambled with can't erase the arrogance of the rest of the paragraph. Neither yours nor my statements are in good taste and, in person, would lead to a physical altercation.

In the new world we cherish the diversity that makes us great.

[Jock Scot]

Well I thought that I was being exceedingly tactful and yes kind and unconfrontational.The fact that we in Scotland don't have a problem with calling a kilt a kilt and the some of the rest of the world do is fairly obviously your problem and not ours. That is a fact and a pretty minor one at that. What is there to take offence at?

The fact that you are offended by that, I cannot understand, nevertheless please be assured that no offence was intended-----far from it.

[tundramanq]

The thing that scares me is the mind set behind it. It's the kind of thing that set Germany up for a clown like Hitler and his ethnic purity campaigns. It's also the reason you can't close your eyes to the rest of the world. Radicalism eventually has and will spread again to your shores.

[Jock Scot]

The thing that scares me is the mind set behind it. It's the kind of thing the set Germany up for a clown like Hitler and his ethnic purity campaigns. It's also the reason you can't close your eyes to the rest of the world. Radicalism eventually has and will spread again to your shores.

Now just hold hard a moment, we are talking about a kilt here, not some plot to take over the world! Let us please have a sense of proportion here.

I am talking about the Scots calling a kilt a kilt, as they have mostly done since birth and from times past and they think nothing of it, that is what a kilt is ---a kilt. Others from outwith Scotland, as is plainly shown by contributers to this thread, clearly demonstrate that some outwith Scotland define a kilt as a skirt. All I did was point out that we in Scotland do not think that way. I genuinely thought that some of you might be interested in that point of view.

[Peter Crowe]

The thing that scares me is the mind set behind it. It's the kind of thing the set Germany up for a clown like Hitler and his ethnic purity campaigns. It's also the reason you can't close your eyes to the rest of the world. Radicalism eventually has and will spread again to your shores.

I am sorry but you are reading something into Jock's words that simply isn't there! The man was talking about culture not race or ethnicity and therefore to conflate his views with the rise of Hitlerism during the Weimar era in Germany is simply wrong. Whatever offence you felt or took does not justify what you state above.

To state (as he did) that North America is a different culture (in fact many cultures) which is somewhat removed from the kilt's place in the culture of Scotland is not racist, not arrogant, and certainly not predicated on ethnocentrism.

Your comments about extremism or 'radicalism' (that word has a different connotation there) in Scotland also betray a lack of understanding of Scottish public life, which for all it's problems has never been fertile ground for far-right 'racist' political movements.

[LitTrog]

Jock this paragraph, Is the one I find offensive and I don't offend easily:

I say this as kindly as I can. It is you chaps from afar that have problems with this, not us. I suppose its to do with your culture being watered down by other cultures and by time and distance and of course if you choose to wear the kilt "out there" you are bound to stand out and thus catch the eye of those that might mock.

I normally try to stay out of these things because my tone and delivery lends itself well to misinterpretation. However, I'm left scratching my head why this was the least bit offensive or scary. It's true! The Scottish culture is COMPLETELY watered-down in the US. I get more questions about being Irish than I do about being Scottish when I'm in my kilt. Think that happens in Scotland? Jock's comment was an honest evaluation, not an attempt to diminish anyone personally.

And, BTW, diversity is usually a recipe for internal conflict and Balkanization, not strength. When diverse backgrounds can rally around a dominant culture, that's what leads to strength. Presents its own set of problems, for sure, but you can't have 20 groups pulling in 20 different directions.

Now I've done it.

[MacSpadger]

The thing that scares me is the mind set behind it. It's the kind of thing the set Germany up for a clown like Hitler and his ethnic purity campaigns. It's also the reason you can't close your eyes to the rest of the world. Radicalism eventually has and will spread again to your shores.

I think this is really one of the most bizarre conclusions I have read on here. There is an awful lot of posts by American members where I don't understand what is being discussed, but, having read carefully; coming from a country where a kilt is called a kilt and not called a skirt equates with the beginnings of fascism? I really am even more confused than normal with this. How did we go from kilt nomenclature to Hitler and "an isolated inbred cult who has expelled those who think differently for centuries" in the blink of an eye?

[tundramanq]

Jock seems to think of the american culture as "watered down" not enhanced by diversity. The vast majority of us are Americans first , Scottish second. The Plaque on the Statue of Liberty states why we are a unified but diverse culture.
BTW - the "nice skirt" comment is not a problem here - usually.

[MacSpadger]

I read it as Scottish culture being watered down in the USA, not American culture being watered down.