Kilts, The Wise Financial Choice

[arrogcow]

[QUOTE=filman]howdy all

I do have ... and a Pittsburgh Kilt witch I beleve is now AmeriKilt. /QUOTE]
Two different companies (AK is actually older).

Adam

[Pittsburgh Kilts]

howdy all

......and a Pittsburgh Kilt witch I beleve is now AmeriKilt.

AH!!!! Pittsburgh Kilts is not, nor will ever be, Amerikilt! I'm not going to go into the manufacturing differences here, but you can see how my kilts are sewn by looking at my construction page. If you've seen an Amerikilt, I think you'll be able to tell the difference.

There are some great kiltmakers on Xmarksthescot who I very much respect. They are craftsmen, dedicated to their business but who still "play nice with others". I'm afaid I have reason to NOT put AK in the same category.

Peace,

[Alan H]

I'm wearing a heavily-pleated wraparound skirt-like garment on me **** today. It's made of canvas.

It's got an over apron. It's got an under-apron. I've got on a sporran to go with it. The sporran was made in Pakistan. I also have a wide belt and a very nice pewter knotwork belt buckle. The apron is held down with kilt pin.

I made it. The materials cost me under $30...... and I am going to call it a kilt and wear it with my head held up and a smile on my face.

If all kilts that aren't worsted wool and made in Scotland are "pretend" kilts and second-rate trash, truly "kindergarden" skirts, then I politely request folks consider the canvas kilts and khaki canvas aprons issued to the Black Watch regiment during WWI.

Not wool. Canvas. Clearly then, all the Black Watch who wore such things wore skirts in WWI.

I politely request that we consider the Sikh regiments of the Indian and Pakistani armies.

A little light reading for everyone's edification...

http://orbat.com/site/history/open1/pakistan_ffr.html

http://www.argylls.co.uk/allied.html

I might dare to ask, then.....where were the Sikh Regiments kilts made? The Punjab kilts? It only stands to reason that they were made in Pakistan and India. There's a REASON that the Pakistani fabric industry makes so much Highlandwear. I invite those who self-righteously dismiss those who wear something up to their standards with words such as "pretend kilt" and "kindergarden skirt" to take the matter up with the members of the Punjab Regiment. They may have something to say about those opinions.


It HAS to be made in Scotland
It HAS to cost an arm and a leg
It HAS to be worsted wool from Scottish sheep

....or it's trash, "pretend" and "kindergarden". Well, folks are entitled to their own opinions. Yes, they certainly are. So in the light of that inalienable right, I will hold an opinion regarding people who feel it just fine to use words like "trash"..."kindergarden" and "pretend" to describe what other people wear. I will hold that opinion until I see evidence that causes me to change it.

I trust that my directness, inherited from my Scots ancestors, is duly appreciated.

[Alan H]

I look forward to creating a KILT....

...handsewn by me, from fabric made in Canada in the near future. It will have pleats. It will have an over-apron and an under apron. It will be made of worsted wool. It will have a tartan design, specific to the X Marks group woven into the cloth. It will take me many hours to create. I will "practice" on less expensive, wool, made-in-Scotland tartan cloth so that I don't spoil my made-in-Canada cloth.

I will wear it (I hope) with pride, and it will last me many years, because I will take care of it.

I have no argument with the outlook that says that a handmade worsted wool kilt, created with care and precision by someone who takes pride in their craft and works in the traditional manner, is a magnificent garment. Absolutely it is, it will last for years and years and I will strive to do my best to create one of similar quality.

It's the attitude that says, nose in the air, that everything *else* is trash *Humph!*, that comes off as utterly constipated.

AND...... I might add, if kilts are so terribly popular in Scotland, then why do we hear over and over and over again from people that visit that they spent three weeks and Scotland and never saw a single man wearing a kilt. Why is it that the only Scots who wear kilts outside of weddings and funerals.....apparently....are either pipers working for some tourist money, or the Tartan Army at a football game? If kilt-wearing is so terribly popular in Scotland, then why do we hear multiple stories about Americans or Kiwis going to Scotland, wearing a kilt, and having tourists tell them that they're the first kilt-wearing man they've seen in weeks?

Why IS that?

The world has gotten bigger, ladies and gentlemen. Scotsmen wear blue jeans now, not just Cowboys in the American West. It's not just Japanese wearing flip-flop zori's anymore. My goodness, but there are Scotsmen that go surfing, you know? It's not just for Hawaiian's any more. The list goes on and on.

The same goes with kilts.

all right, rant over..........

[macwilkin]

If all kilts that aren't worsted wool and made in Scotland are "pretend" kilts and second-rate trash, truly "kindergarden" skirts, then I politely request folks consider the canvas kilts and khaki canvas aprons issued to the Black Watch regiment during WWI.

Not wool. Canvas. Clearly then, all the Black Watch who wore such things wore skirts in WWI.

I politely request that we consider the Sikh regiments of the Indian and Pakistani armies.

A little light reading for everyone's edification...

http://orbat.com/site/history/open1/pakistan_ffr.html

http://www.argylls.co.uk/allied.html

I might dare to ask, then.....where were the Sikh Regiments kilts made? The Punjab kilts? It only stands to reason that they were made in Pakistan and India. There's a REASON that the Pakistani fabric industry makes so much Highlandwear.

Alan,

Re: the Indian & Pakistani Armies. While several regiments in both do have pipers and wear tartan (The 3rd Battalion of the Sikh Regiment comes to mind), they do not, for the most part, wear kilts. Even the Gurkhas of the British & Indian Armies do not wear them, just tartans -- a tartan patch behind the badge on a beret or on the pugarree, or sweat-band of a slouch hat, or as a piper's plaid or pipe ribbons. A couple of regiments wear trews.

Take a look at the Sikh pipers on this site:

http://www.clanrattray.org/sikhregiment.html

btw, I should point out that there are no Sikh Regiments in the modern Pakistani Army, just in the old Frontier Force, which was part of the British Indian Army.

Canvas kilts: I have never found any evidence or a photo of canvas kilts being worn by any Highland regiment during the First World War. I do know of a khaki-coloured kilt worn by a battalion of the Black Watch of Canada, but I have never seen reference to a whole kilt in canvas, just the kilt aprons, which were introduced during the South African (Boer) War. That doesn't mean it's not true, and if someone has the documentation, then I would love to see it -- Sav or Matt might have something.

Cheers,

Todd

[filman]

Sorry For my mistake

[arrogcow]

Filman, where in OH are you? And does your name imply that you work in film?

Adam

[filman]

I live in Reading

As for filman it is a nick i picked up a long time ago my name being phil so that is it .. I am between jobs now ,, but am a cook by trade

[Alan H]

Alan,

Re: the Indian & Pakistani Armies. While several regiments in both do have pipers and wear tartan (The 3rd Battalion of the Sikh Regiment comes to mind), they do not, for the most part, wear kilts. Even the Gurkhas of the British & Indian Armies do not wear them, just tartans -- a tartan patch behind the badge on a beret or on the pugarree, or sweat-band of a slouch hat, or as a piper's plaid or pipe ribbons. A couple of regiments wear trews.

Take a look at the Sikh pipers on this site:

http://www.clanrattray.org/sikhregiment.html

btw, I should point out that there are no Sikh Regiments in the modern Pakistani Army, just in the old Frontier Force, which was part of the British Indian Army.

Canvas kilts: I have never found any evidence or a photo of canvas kilts being worn by any Highland regiment during the First World War. I do know of a khaki-coloured kilt worn by a battalion of the Black Watch of Canada, but I have never seen reference to a whole kilt in canvas, just the kilt aprons, which were introduced during the South African (Boer) War. That doesn't mean it's not true, and if someone has the documentation, then I would love to see it -- Sav or Matt might have something.

Cheers,

Todd

I stand corrected on my facts. Thanks, Todd. As always, you're a source of excellent information.

My irritation remains. Seeing as it does little good, however, to snarl online, I am going to go do something else for the rest of the day.

[Archangel]

Alan,I do know of a khaki-coloured kilt worn by a battalion of the Black Watch of Canada, but I have never seen reference to a whole kilt in canvas, just the kilt aprons, which were introduced during the South African (Boer) War. That doesn't mean it's not true, and if someone has the documentation, then I would love to see it -- Sav or Matt might have something.

Cheers,

Todd

Could the confusion come from the wrap-around kilt aprons like on the cover of Osprey's Scottish Units? I believe the London Scottish marching postcard shows a similar full apron cover.

The Ghurkas were attached to Scottish units in WW1, my grand-dad's for example. Tartan patch probably came from that. (My guess.)