Another Question

[D.A. Guertin]

That brings about a particularly memorable occassion... Be quite mindful when kneeling in the grass!

[MacMillan of Rathdown]

MOR what might be considered as potentially offensive in 1914 is not necessarily the same in 2010.

Parse it all you want-- consideration of others is the hallmark of a gentleman now, as it was in your grandfather's day. It has nothing to do with where one lives, unless where you live the standards of acceptable behaviour are less than the standards adhered to by gentlemen elsewhere in the United Kingdom, or Canada, or anywhere else in the civilized world.

Trefor, no one on this forum is the arbiter of what is, or is not, offensive-- yourself included. Believe it or not, there are people out there who would find the sight of your genitalia vulgar, disgusting, and offensive-- or worse, for you-- laughable. You may disagree, but it is their opinion that matters to them, not your idea of proper Highland-- sorry, Welsh-- attire.

It's that simple.

A gentleman behaves the way a gentleman behaves because he does not wish to unintentionally give offense to anyone. Ever.

Those who do not care if they give offense may dress as they please in the presence of ladies and children. They may not be accounted as gentlemen, but that choice is theirs to make.

[auld argonian]

That brings about a particularly memorable occassion... Be quite mindful when kneeling in the grass!

I'd also be sure to be careful around small dogs...whenever I kneel down to pet my mom's Maltese, she runs under the kilt and hides....to the merriment of all, of course.

Best

AA

[Riverkilt]

Max was asking about the first time...but the feelings of unease can also happen after much experience enjoying the FREEDOM of wearing a kilt regimental style.

Twice now I've been accused of exposing myself while seated in a chair. Both accusers were older women. Both would have needed X-Ray vision to see my man parts from where they were seated. But the accusation was made.

Once indirectly by having a very shy young waiter be told to come and tell me. The other behind my back in a whisper campaign among friends.

The first was easy to deal with. Just told the poor embarrassed waiter that was impossible, please pay no mind to the lady's accusations.

The other was not possible to deal with because by the time a friend told me what the lady was saying behind my back the encounter with her was months old.

I would attribute it to both ladies hearing that men are regimental under their kilts and therefore the flesh of my lower thigh she saw became, in her mind, my man parts...( If such were the case I'd be making my living in the adult entertainment industry).

So, add to the list of fears of accidental exposure the fear of false accusations of exposure. The accused is left to "prove" there was no exposure. Sort of like having to prove you're not a Communist...

It is soooo sad, and soooo weird that none of this happens to a skirted lady....but let a man don a kilt and suddenly "proper ladies" are seeing man parts where there are none to be seen...

[Bugbear]

That brings about a particularly memorable occassion... Be quite mindful when kneeling in the grass!

I always wore "wee trews"* with the kilt. There was one time I was at a park ground of sorts with a friend, and there were no benches left to sit. My friend, who did have a small child with her, wanted to sit on the grass, which was full of dead twigs etc. I knew my low quality hose and kilt would be ruined if I were to sit on the grass. So, I was going to stand as they sat down beside me. I realized that would be not so good of an idea, so I made sure my kilt was well wrapped around the back of my legs and well tucked and placed in front, then squatted down and sat on my heels basically. It looked a little odd, I'm sure, but all was well.

After that, I began keeping a large cloth, bigger than a handkerchief, in my sporran to spread out on what ever I may be sitting on when I wore a kilt.

* "wee trews," from MOR.

[ccga3359]

Sort of like having to prove you're not a Communist...

I'm so glad that you brought it up.

Are you, or have you ever been a...?

[McClef]

Parse it all you want-- consideration of others is the hallmark of a gentleman now, as it was in your grandfather's day. It has nothing to do with where one lives, unless where you live the standards of acceptable behaviour are less than the standards adhered to by gentlemen elsewhere in the United Kingdom, or Canada, or anywhere else in the civilized world.

In my grandfather's day ladies wore extremely long skirts and very voluminous bathing costumes. What was considered shocking was somewhat different. Presumably you consider that there were no gentlemen in Highland Regiments where mirrors were used to check their status.

I doubt that Queen Victoria ever felt offended with the notion that some of the kilted gentlemen with whom she came into contact might potentially be regimental.

And I would suggest that from all the posts I have read both now and in the past that wearing something underneath is a bigger issue in the US than this side of the Pond.

Treffor, no one on this forum is the arbiter of what is, or is not, offensive-- yourself included. Believe it or not, there are people out there who would find the sight of your genitalia vulgar, disgusting, and offensive-- or worse, for you-- laughable. You may disagree, but it is their opinion that matters to them, not your idea of proper Highland-- sorry, Welsh-- attire.

It's that simple.

This is a somewhat crude and ad hominem statement (I will assume that the extra "f" was a typo though). You are implying that because I may have the temerity to disagree with your viewpoint on this matter that I must have some kind of flasher mentality which is assure you is not the case. You are also presuming that their opinion is that they are more comfortable in the presence of a kilted gentleman because they assume he is wearing undergarments. That being the case there should never be kilt check situations or raisings of the question. Nor it is anything to do with my idea of proper attire but with an individual's choice and resultant behaviour.

A gentleman behaves the way a gentleman behaves because he does not wish to unintentionally give offense to anyone. Ever.

Those who do not care if they give offense may dress as they please in the presence of ladies and children. They may not be accounted as gentlemen, but that choice is theirs to make.

I am afraid that I must give this dogmatic statement the same credence as others that have been made about gentlemen such as Charles Hamilton in Gone with the Wind that a Southern Gentleman could whip the Yankees, despite their superior industry and manpower, purely because they were not, in his view, Gentlemen and Lord Alfred Douglas in Wilde that "no gentlemen ever knows what is in his bank account."

Avoidance of all offence, or potential offence, is impossible. One is much less likely to offend through what is not seen but rather imagined. I could still offend by my choice of tie or not having shaved or not complimenting a lady on her new hairdo or whatever.

Riverkilt's analogy is quite apt. How would one prove that one is being a gentleman by wearing something without showing it?

[robthehiker]

Believe it or not, there are people out there who would find the sight of your genitalia vulgar, disgusting, and offensive-- or worse, for you-- laughable. .

I was tempted to use this as my signature line but thought better of it.

A gentleman behaves the way a gentleman behaves because he does not wish to unintentionally give offense to anyone. Ever.

Those who do not care if they give offense may dress as they please in the presence of ladies and children. They may not be accounted as gentlemen, but that choice is theirs to make.

I generally try to avoid giving offense but I disagree with the notion that one shouldn't be regimental around ladies. There's no reason they'd have to know what I was or was not wearing underneath. So unless I'm going to be climbing ladders or standing on my head I'm likely to be regimental.

Children are another matter entirely and I do not go regimental if they are going to be around.

[MacMillan of Rathdown]

"A gentleman behaves the way a gentleman behaves because he does not wish to unintentionally give offense to anyone. Ever."

Trefor, simply because a statement may be dogmatic doesn't make it any the less true.

How would one prove that one is being a gentleman by wearing something without showing it?

Trefor, a gentleman doesn't have to prove anything. He is a gentleman because he constantly strives to do "the right thing" in every facet of his daily life. He may not always succeed, but he always tries to get it right.

I've yet to meet a gentleman who would disagree with either of the above statements.

(And my apologies for my stuttering keyboard )

[Zardoz]

I think planning ahead to avoid unintentionally giving offense to anyone and everyone he might encounter would strain the abilities of even the most well organized gentleman!

If anyone has a method for knowing ahead of time when they might accidentally encounter children in public, please PM me, I want to apply that forcasting skill to picking horses and lottery tickets! plus I try to avoid kids in general!