Traditional Civilian Highland SHIRTS

[Cygnus]

In ye olden days (that is prior to about 1960) good shirts came with longer tails so that collars (and cuffs) could be replaced if they became frayed or stained, simply by cutting them out of the surplus length of the shirt tail. Because the collar and/or cuffs were cut from the tail, they were always a perfect match for the shirt, regardless of the number of times it had been laundered.

Now, or so it seems, one is lucky if their shirt has enough tail to stay tucked into their trousers or kilt!

I've always thought it odd that as the "normal" level at which trousers are worn moves down, the ends of the shirt tails move up. It is really frustrating.

I think it has something to do with the (relatively) new acceptance of un-tucked shirts in casual environments.

[English Bloke]

I've always thought it odd that as the "normal" level at which trousers are worn moves down, the ends of the shirt tails move up. It is really frustrating.

I think it has something to do with the (relatively) new acceptance of un-tucked shirts in casual environments.

And perhaps, that half the world seems obsessed with showing off their underpants!

[MacLowlife]

Yesterday the postman brought me two shirts, clearly stored for a while after laundering many long years ago. They are of the stiff front, button-up-the-back, detached collar variety. I am sure somebody knows where to buy these new, but I doubt I could afford them. One came from Rogers, Peet, of NY & Boston. Anybody know how long they have been gone?

[Galician]

Oh, you brought back a name from the past!

Check this info in Wiki

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Rogers_Peet

[MacMillan of Rathdown]

Yesterday the postman brought me two shirts, clearly stored for a while after laundering many long years ago. They are of the stiff front, button-up-the-back, detached collar variety. I am sure somebody knows where to buy these new, but I doubt I could afford them. One came from Rogers, Peet, of NY & Boston. Anybody know how long they have been gone?

Sadly, the formal dress shirt has not been commercially available since, at least, the early to mid-1980s. Even custom shirt and high-end makers in the UK such as Budd and New & Lingwood are unable to provide these shirts at any thing approaching a realistic price (GBP 300+ strikes me as a "we really can't be bothered" price). When these were available "off the shelf" from Brooks Brothers in the '80s they retailed for about $125.00.

These shirts are vastly superior to ordinary dress shirts as the fronts stay flat when seated, with no gapping at the placket to expose the tee-shirt promoting your local fishing tackle emporium; and, of course, no chance of one's Order of the Alaskan Sled Dogs becoming hung up in one's shirt front whilst waltzing with a dowager duchess.

Perhaps we can encourage CMcG to find a custom shirt maker in the Orient who would be able to supply such shirts to the disciminati?

[MacLowlife]

AND, it is much easier to put the studs through the solid front, then button up the back. Or get someone to help you. Help buttoning up the back seems perfectly reasonable. Help putting your studs in the front seems a little helpless. I have one shirt with the "sneak in" slot to allow you to get your hand in there, but that seems less than perfect. I wish my dates had shirts with that slot, though...

But seriously, 300 anything is a joke price for a shirt. Maybe 300 Rupees or possibly 300 Fr.

So, on the topic of getting one's stud front shirt on without spoiling the starch, what does the Rabble? Pop it over with most of them done or struggle with the one-hand-in/one-hand-out? I have some old studs that have a disc back. That helps, too...

[CMcG]

Perhaps we can encourage CMcG to find a custom shirt maker in the Orient who would be able to supply such shirts to the disciminati?

I definitely look forward to investigating the reputedly excellent and affordable tailors of Hong Kong. Unfortunately, I won't be there until the start of September, so don't hold your breath on the report...

Any more details on these stiff front, button-up-the-back, detached collar shirts that MacLowlife is talking about?

[Cygnus]

I definitely look forward to investigating the reputedly excellent and affordable tailors of Hong Kong. Unfortunately, I won't be there until the start of September, so don't hold your breath on the report...

Any more details on these stiff front, button-up-the-back, detached collar shirts that MacLowlife is talking about?

So... it's the end of September. Any success in finding a good tailor for formal shirts, CMcG?

[CMcG]

So... it's the end of September. Any success in finding a good tailor for formal shirts, CMcG?

Thus far I have not encountered the rear closure, stiff front, formal shirts with detachable collars described earlier in this thread. Hong Kong is very modern and most tailors here seem to pride themselves on eschewing anything older in style. Armed with photos, diagrams and descriptions, I might be able to have someone make one up for me. Part of the problem is that I have never seen or worn a traditional formal shirt to know exactly what to ask for... that being said, there are plenty of tailors around here that could make a formal shirt that follows the more current front closure, attached collar style.

After parsing through some other fora, I found a recommendation for Legal Tailor. The are headquatered in Hong Kong but tour around to many countries doing fittings. The offer fully bespoke tailoring and, as their name implies, also make court dress for barristers, which involves detachable collar shirts. Their starting price for shirts appears to be less than Darcy (as mentioned by saxandpipes in post #92). I haven't contacted them yet though, so I'm not sure if they do the full traditional specs formal shirt but with ties to legal traditions they seem like a good bet.
http://www.legaltailor.com/tailored_shirts

Is there a happy medium between the traditional and contemporary versions of a formal shirt? What is most essential? It seems like a front closure with detachable collar might be a more easy and affordable option...

On a more successful note, I did have a couple shirts custom made at a little shop on the second floor of a shopping arcade in Mong Kok. One is more smart casual tattersall with medium spread collar (built in stays), regular cuffs. The other is a dressier white with a subtle check patter, wide spead collar (also built in stays), French cuffs (with CMcG monogram). Neither have breast pockets and both are a perfect fit with extra long body so they stay tucked in. They cost about $35 CAD each and took a week to make from one extensive set of measurements. Unfortunately for my internet brethren, they only do in-person sales.

[Cygnus]

Perhaps we can encourage CMcG to find a custom shirt maker in the Orient who would be able to supply such shirts to the disciminati?

I would certainly be interested in this, but would such a tailor be capable of starching the bib of the shirt properly?