The Scots Who Left

[Mark Stephenson]

These address a lot of questions raised by the friendly frictions that sometimes surface on this forum, especially the third in the series. Thanks for sharing!

I was somewhat surprised by the overall negative tenor of the 3rd article. I await with interest the reactions of the rabble.

[piperdbh]

It's kind of amusing how the author decries the stereotypes and preconceived notions that we Southern Americans all, each and every one of us, with no exceptions whatsoever, hold about his country.

[Father Bill]

I was somewhat surprised by the overall negative tenor of the 3rd article. I await with interest the reactions of the rabble.

"Rabble" Mark, not "rabble."

[Gael Ridire]

This is very interesting article and hurts because of the truth it contains. It helps to put into perspective the recent comments posted by native Scots. I must admit that I have had problems with those who think that at games it is 1745 or 1314 and run around with claymores, targes, baskethilts & dirks. Re-enactors have their place and living history is a wonderful educational tool, but. . .

The sudo histories are rampant at Celtic festivals. I bought into many of them the first couple of years until I researched the truth about kilts, Highlanders & Lowlanders, kirkin' o the Tartan, etc. I must admit my attitude probably helps disseminate some of this thought when I say that "to me the Irish & Scots are the same." I don't mean to insult, but as I've commented in other posts, strapping on the kilt is a spiritual experience for me. I feel connected to my forefathers. But pretending it is 1745 or 1314 I do not do! Not even for a hour. And I've been shot down many a time for telling true history over the romantic versions.

Remembering one's ancestors, one's origins, and one's past is a good thing, even if some buy into the romantic version. It is better then forgetting it or not caring at all.

[Jock Scot]

---- even if some buy into the romantic version. It is better then forgetting it or not caring at all.

Whilst accepting that we all are entitled to a point of view, I really and genuinely am not so sure about the statement above.

[Ian.MacAllan]

Whilst accepting that we all are entitled to a point of view, I really and genuinely am not so sure about the statement above.

I, on the other hand, am not tactful enough to be unsure that preserving falsity is dangerous. Believing falsity to be true seriously impairs one's ability to reason correctly and may even drive one to seriously inappropriate behavior.

Sorry to disagree with you on this point, Jock; disagreeing with you is difficult for me.

.

[ctbuchanan]

New to the thread so I hope I don't rehash too much.

I have convened a tent for the Clan Buchanan in New England for many years and have attended games across the USA. While I agree that there are those who attend in an attempt to relive the spirit of '45, I believe that there are far more who do so to recognize their heritage. Some families obviously left Scotland centuries ago so the link for many is tenuous at best. The stories, legends and myths of Scotland abound so some cling to "old" history. But most come for the camaraderie, music, athletics, pipe bands, whisky tastings etc.

I didn't notice any mention of the movie "Braveheart" which was the best thing to happen to clan societies here and the worst thing to happen to an understanding of Scottish history. There was a huge boom in interest in all things Scottish after that movie came out. While it gave a big boost to games attendance (and society memberships), it also created (as most agree) a totally erroneous image of what it means to be Scottish. We still struggle with that dichotomy: attracting members while trying to set the record straight and convince people that not ALL Scots painted their faces blue and mooned the enemy.

Last comment: I am first generation USA (Mum was born in Scotland) and FAR more of my family here own kilts than my cousins back in Alba. So my guess is that there are more kilts in the USA than in Scotland especially if you include the utilikilt styles. North Carolina alone has more people with Scots surnames than all of Scotland. And I'm going out on a limb to suggest that there are far more pipe bands here as well (although I have no evidence to back up that claim)

Enjoyed reading the many comments as always.

[Gael Ridire]

I couldn't concur more about why people attend games. Some relive the '45 (I don't understand these), but most do to experience the festivities and all they have to offer. That is what attracted me. After joining a clan society I then began studying the history, I love history. And I think the best thing my forefathers did was leaving the ol' sod and coming to America beginning in 1621 and ending in late 1850s. As I've posted before, strapping on the kilt is a spiritual experience for me, it reminds me of who I am and from wince I came. albeit hundred of years ago.

Braveheart did do much good and some bad for history. At one game after the movie came out I argued with a guy who instead that the movie was true history. All I can say is who in their right mind believes in Holywood's version of historical events.

A little over a decade ago a study was made at Brigham Young University on how well students knew their genealogy. Why BYU? It's a private school owned by the LDS (Mormon) Church where one of the cornerstones of the their doctrine is doing one's genealogy. The study was very interesting for it showed that those who should know something about their heritage knew nothing. Nine out of ten didn't even know their grandmothers maiden names, let alone any dates and places, and forget going further back on the pedigree. They who should know, knew nothing!

I may be wrong in combining the traditions and cultures of Scotland and Ireland for me and my family, but they will know about their heritage, as will my grandchildren to be. And one of the ways is by attending Celtic festivals and feeling & hearing the culture.

I'm not interested in the modern history, I'm glad for them advancing forward and that society is uplifted by this, but it is the history that interests me, and the true history, not that presented by Holywood and romantics.

[Jock Scot]

Sorry to disagree with you on this point, Jock; disagreeing with you is difficult for me.

.

I would not loose any sleep over it my dear chap, people often disagree with me. Life would be exceedingly boring otherwise!

[Joshua]

One of my clients, upon finding out I was a games athlete, told me she her parents were from Scotland, and her grandparents still lived there.

She said at her brother's wedding, her father (born in Scotland) was the only person not wearing a kilt... in his words he had to wear one in school and he'd never wear "that itchy thing" again. Her grandfather and uncles from Scotland wore them, as well as her American-born brother (who wore his dad's hand-me-down for the wedding).

Funny though, her family was from Glasgow and she's a late-20's/early-30's gal. I'm guessing her parents would have been in school no earlier than the late 50's through 60's. Were kilted schools common in the lowlands at that time?