A Cautionary Tale if Your Pipes Have Ivory

[creagdhubh]

The pipes have been returned, after a hefty fine was paid, of course.

[Aussie_Don]

<dons Nomex suit >
There is another side to this -- elephants are getting way
too close to extinction. And the reason is ivory.

Don't misunderstand me, I'm fully aware that the pipes under
discussion were from a time when the extinction was not an
issue. But I believe that there is a real need to make sure that
anything that includes ivory is clearly certified as not being
"modern ivory". And this is not PC gone mad or anything of the
sort. There are a lot of ivory poachers out there who'd like
nothing more than to manage to get their ivory certified as being
from "before".

I personally have a good deal of sympathy with the pipers in the
original story. The real problem is setting up a system that will
protect living elephants without making things impossible for
those who own historic ivory items. It sounds like they may
have got it wrong this time. But if you think that it is important
that your children/grandchildren should have the chance to see
an elephant in the wild, then you need to consider the importance
of this protection.

-Don

[tky58]

With respect to our brother's across the "pond", Americans have a long history (238 years) of disliking high handed government interference.

This system that caught these teenage boys is fraught with bureaucratic idiocy. The professional ivory smuggler is not going to deal with teenagers as mules. He is going to bury 50 pounds of the stuff in a shipping container of something else and run it through a busy seaport. He is going to take his time and have all his papers in order so as not to raise suspicion. Most of the time, customs will not bother with something so complicated.

However 2 kids who told customs they had the items before they went into Canada and declared them upon return. That is just easy picking for the bored customs agent who would rather be catching all those illegal Canadians slipping into the US in search of a better life. (I pull my tongue out of my cheek and not go further in fear of becoming political)

Truth is I appreciate our border agents and believe they are trying to do a good job in a tough situation. Bureaucratic idiocy is systemic and given a choice most bureaucrats will want to do the right thing.

[Theyoungkiltman]

The answer: paint over the ivory.

[Theyoungkiltman]

Imho the problem is that all the foreign gov. burn or otherwise destroy ivory captured from poachers when it could be sold to reduce demand. Some african nations have special permission to do that now. This will not entirely end poaching but along with tighter enforcement of poaching laws (not possession of small quantities) and increasing stability of nations that contain elephants poaching will be greatly reduced.

[TheOfficialBren]

As a musician I find this situation absolutely fracked!

Have you guys heard the story about Gibson Guitars having one of their plants raided by a flipping SWAT team of Federal agents because of a minor mistake on some paperwork? The government thought they were using illegal, rare woods in the manufacture of their instruments. Their facilities were raided and many tousands of dollars of raw materials and equipment were confiscated. I believe that some instruments were taken as well.

It turns out that there was no contraband whatsoever and that Gibson Guitars, a company with a sterling reputation before and since, had actually been following the law to the letter. A stupid numbskull somewhere up the ladder screwed up and as a result the heavy hand of the state came down upon them. (Not going any further to avoid breaking the politics rule. I'll ammend this post if necessary to avoid a rule violation.)

Reposting this piping link on Facebook. Thanks, Alex.

[OC Richard]

Apparently it's worse for us pipers than we had thought

http://www.thebagpipeplace.com/Ivory_Law.html

Here's the actual US Government site

http://www.fws.gov/international/tra...d-answers.html

It's not just travelling with ivory; here in the USA it is now illegal to possess ivory that doesn't have proper documentation.

To qualify for the certificate you have to be able to establish that the ivory was "legally acquired and removed from the wild" prior to 1976 AND that you yourself acquired them before February 2014.

Pipers with ivory-mounted pipes can't sell these instruments, and carrying them in a public place subjects them to possible seizure, unless they have certificates. Us pipers with vintage pipes are either scrambling to get certificates, or (if we have pipes that can't be certified) sending our lovely vintage pipes off to local makers to have the ivory stripped off and replaced with anything else.

Don't put it past government agents to show up at a Highland Games and start snapping up pipes. It happened here, a few years ago, when an agent at a local Highland Games seized one vendor's entire van-full of sealskin sporrans.

[creagdhubh]

Don't put it past government agents to show up at a Highland Games and start snapping up pipes. It happened here, a few years ago, when an agent at a local Highland Games seized one vendor's entire van-full of sealskin sporrans.

Oh my word!

[Jack Daw]

Apparently it's worse for us pipers than we had thought

http://www.thebagpipeplace.com/Ivory_Law.html

It's not just travelling with ivory; here in the USA it is now illegal to possess ivory that doesn't have proper documentation.

To qualify for the certificate you have to be able to establish that your pipes were brought into the USA prior to 1976 AND that you yourself acquired them before February 2014.

Pipers with ivory-mounted pipes can't sell these instruments, and carrying them in a public place subjects them to possible seizure, unless they have certificates. Many of us will be sending our lovely vintage pipes off to local makers to have the ivory stripped off and replaced with anything else.

Don't put it past government agents to show up at a Highland Games and start snapping up pipes. It happened here, a few years ago, when an agent at a local Highland Games seized one vendor's entire van-full of sealskin sporrans.

I'll pass the word on to some of my piper-buddies that have ivory pipes.

[tulloch]

The pipes have been returned, after a hefty fine was paid, of course.

What is the whole story? Why a fine if he had the certificates? How much was the fine?