Identity in the Scottish Diaspora

[jfraser]

Not my area of study, Nathan, but I don't think Scots 'avoid' words like Pakistani Scot. They simply have no need for them. Mind you, if I hear the name Hamish MacSporran I probably subconsciously know he is ethnic Highland, and if I hear the name Ali Mohammed I take a guess that he is from somewhere in the middle east. Unless, of course, Ali is a she and her husband is the Mohammed in the family. Or, if Ali was born in Scotland. That would mean that he is from Scotland and that would make him a Scottish Scot

And yet in Scotland the term Anglo-Scot, often shortened to Anglos, is used to refer to people born in Scotland with English ancestry.

This has been copied from the net, not my definition.

[ThistleDown]

Exceptions in every culture, jfraser. Slightly nasty in its meaning, Anglo means a Scot living in England by choice, but wanting to vote in Scotland. At least that's my definition off the top of my head. Maybe it means the opposite. In any case, we can all find these singular exceptions (like a Floridian in California being called a Floridian-Californian) if we search hard enough. Take it from me, it's just not done, old boy

[Nathan]

I've heard a lot of people from the UK refer to Brits of South Asian descent as "Asian". Clearly, they're no longer Asian if they live in the UK but everyone seems to understand the essence of what's being said. The geographic reference is being used as an ethnic reference. When I was there, an English mate if mine who's parents were Indo Guyanese was also called Asian. My point isn't so much the word as the context in which it is being used.

[The Q]

I have not anywhere said we are "moving towards" our own government. (By the way, Q is not a resident of Scotland so it wouldn't be his government)
But, if it happens, why would we stop exporting kilts etc?

Alan

Though it would be If I moved back to where my parents and sisters (and decendants) live.

[neloon]

Learned a new word today - JOMO - so I'm leaving this thread for some JOMO.
Maybe I'll learn embroidery. Or maybe I'll found the East Aberdeenshire Left Footed Tiddliwinks Association.
Have fun, y'all y'all.

Alan

[The Q]

One of the problems here is the "Export of Scottishness" is done by advertisers who export the most to their advantage, with little regard to the true state of affairs.
The Kilt and most of the culture discussed in these pages is not Scottish but That of the Gaels (not Irish Gaels) who happen to be resident in that part of this country "The United Kingdom of Country Great Britain and Northern Ireland", that is currently called "Scotland".

The Gaelic culture export or tartan, not including solid groups of Gaelic descent such as in Nova Scotia. Is 99% advertising Hype from Scots (or even English) Advertisers not the Gaels themselves.

In reality, central Scotland is little different in culture than say Newcastle in England, 99% all the Tartan manufacture in Scotland is carried out in the central / Southern areas with no connection to the Gaels. Most those tartan and kilt shops down the Royal mile have more relationship to George IV or Pakistan than to the Highlands.

If you go to the Highlands and visit the castles/ monuments most are set up to be more related to the Advertising image, than the reality at the time and certainly not the reality of modern Highland life.

One of the other problems we have in these discussions is that in the UK in polite society, you do not add a racial grouping to the discussion or a person. It would be seen as racial descrimination even if that group uses it. You don't use the N word in the USA public even though some groups people that formerly would have been called that in public, still use it amoungst themselves.

We've had anti Racial-descrimination training here from our American head office. To us however we find the training descriminatory in itself, using such words as Latino- americans etc and pictures carefully staged with one "Asian" one " White European" one " person of another colour"
and finally putting up pictures up of the Statue of liberty when this multi country company of American (mostly ) ownership has people in almost every country of the world.

Oh Anglo-Scot can also mean an English person living in Scotland or a person of mixed English-Scottish parentage almost anywhere in the world

[ThistleDown]

I've heard a lot of people from the UK refer to Brits of South Asian descent as "Asian". Clearly, they're no longer Asian if they live in the UK but everyone seems to understand the essence of what's being said. The geographic reference is being used as an ethnic reference. When I was there, an English mate if mine who's parents were Indo Guyanese was also called Asian. My point isn't so much the word as the context in which it is being used.

I have heard that in reference to immigrants from the sub-continent, but never combined to form Asian-Scottish.

[ThistleDown]

One of the problems here is the "Export of Scottishness" is done by advertisers who export the most to their advantage, with little regard to the true state of affairs.
The Kilt and most of the culture discussed in these pages is not Scottish but That of the Gaels (not Irish Gaels) who happen to be resident in that part of this country "The United Kingdom of Country Great Britain and Northern Ireland", that is currently called "Scotland".

The Gaelic culture export or tartan, not including solid groups of Gaelic descent such as in Nova Scotia. Is 99% advertising Hype from Scots (or even English) Advertisers not the Gaels themselves.

In reality, central Scotland is little different in culture than say Newcastle in England, 99% all the Tartan manufacture in Scotland is carried out in the central / Southern areas with no connection to the Gaels. Most those tartan and kilt shops down the Royal mile have more relationship to George IV or Pakistan than to the Highlands.

If you go to the Highlands and visit the castles/ monuments most are set up to be more related to the Advertising image, than the reality at the time and certainly not the reality of modern Highland life.

One of the other problems we have in these discussions is that in the UK in polite society, you do not add a racial grouping to the discussion or a person. It would be seen as racial descrimination even if that group uses it. You don't use the N word in the USA public even though some groups people that formerly would have been called that in public, still use it amoungst themselves.

We've had anti Racial-descrimination training here from our American head office. To us however we find the training descriminatory in itself, using such words as Latino- americans etc and pictures carefully staged with one "Asian" one " White European" one " person of another colour"
and finally putting up pictures up of the Statue of liberty when this multi country company of American (mostly ) ownership has people in almost every country of the world.

Oh Anglo-Scot can also mean an English person living in Scotland or a person of mixed English-Scottish parentage almost anywhere in the world

I have a Jamaican-origin friend whose father and mother were both born in the UK. The American media has unapologetically referred to him as 'Black American' and 'Afro-American'.

[Nathan]

I have heard that in reference to immigrants from the sub-continent, but never combined to form Asian-Scottish.

I've heard it in relation to the children of Immigrants from the subcontinent. I think that's the same as a North American descendant of Scottish immigrants being called "Scottish".

[ThistleDown]

This thread started with a good question honestly asked. It was long-ago answered as best as thinking members of this little forum could. Not much point in starting all of that over again so I'll just leave you with the last word here, Nathan.