Short Wasit Tuxedo Jacket

[Iolaus]

http://cgi.ebay.ca/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?...85872&rd=1

Would this type of jacket be a good(cheap) alternative/substitue for a PC Jacket?

Did anyone ever get one of these?

[Thistle Stop]

The short tux jacket looks like a good substitute for a PC. I looked at the seller's eBay site, http://stores.ebay.com/New-York-Tux_...eNameZl2QQtZkm, and they seem to sell them on a regular basis. Just search their site for 'short waist' to find them all. It seems similar to a military mess jacket or waiter's jacket -- no tails in the back.

I agree with Hamish that it's essential to wear the kilt higher than the bottom of the jacket, so the extra 2" rise above the natural waist (i.e., above belly-button level), as a traditional kilt has, is very important. A belt (black, with a formal-type buckle) should be worn, since there's no waistcoat (vest) with this jacket.

[Iolaus]

Am I remembering correctly that a PC has short tails? The seller seems to have the same jacket with short tails.

http://tinyurl.com/7228c




Also, I don't remember if I posted this here or on the UK forum, but here is a similar jacket (without the tails) that doesn't have as much satin, just some yoke trim. It's more expensive at $150, but it's more subtle.

http://tinyurl.com/6v2pf

[Thistle Stop]

Here's what the back of the PC looks like:

[MACKAY]

I've taken a look at the short waisted tux coats offered on eBay and they all seem to be "Western Wear" style. In that I mean they all indicate that they have the western piping accents across the back: "front and back yokes accented with satin piping" I am not sure how that would look with a kilt.

Brian Mackay

[Iolaus]

If it's subtle, like that last one, I could live with it. The full satin lapels on the first one don't appeal to me though.

[macwilkin]

The style of short formal jacket which can be substituted for a PC is called a "Spencer Jacket":

SPENCER JACKET

A style of tuxedo jacket whose hem is just below the waist, rather than below the hip. At the front opening, the hem dips into points, so that the Spencer resembles a tailcoat without the tails.

Another site gives the Spencer's origins:

Earl Spencer and the Short Spencer Jacket 1795

The Spencer was a short top coat without tails worn by men during the 1790s as an extra covering over the tailed coat. It had long sleeves and was frequently decorated with military frogging. Its originator is thought to be Earl Spencer who singed the tails of his coat when standing beside a fire. He then had the tails trimmed off and started a fashion.

I agree with Brian; I personally would stear clear of the "Western" style jacket. The Spencer is similar to the "mess dress" jackets for the British Army.

Cheers,

Todd

[Jimmy Carbomb]

The one thing that some of the other jackets have that better ones don't is that "Western" yoke. The shoulders have the curve-tapered design that is not really appropriate.

There are Pierre Cardin short tux jackets that have a plain yoke. Here's one with the black buttons replaced with Celtic Knot buttons.

Jacket Picture

Being more Irish than Scottish, I chose the round Celttic Knot buttons rather than the diamond Scottish ones. The lapel REALLY works will with a nice black sporran and kilt belt too.

[Thistle Stop]

The one thing that some of the other jackets have that better ones don't is that "Western" yoke. The shoulders have the curve-tapered design that is not really appropriate.

There are Pierre Cardin short tux jackets that have a plain yoke. Here's one with the black buttons replaced with Celtic Knot buttons.

Jacket Picture

Being more Irish than Scottish, I chose the round Celttic Knot buttons rather than the diamond Scottish ones. The lapel REALLY works will with a nice black sporran and kilt belt too.

That looks nice, Jimmy. Good alternative to the PC or Brian Boru jacket.

[Alan H]

How about an Eton jacket? They appear to be pretty shortwaisted, and apparently not worn with a waistcoat. I've never actually seen one in person before.

http://www.uniformalwearhouse.com/ap...ojackets4.html

http://www.genosformalaffair.com/sal...etonjacket.htm

This style seems to open up nicely with room for a sporran....

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll...sPageName=WD1V

Seems like it's available in both one button and three button styles...

http://www.alsformalwear.com/shopexd.asp?id=10340

http://www.alsformalwear.com/shopexd.asp?id=10341

most of those links are to "formal work wear" like waiters outlets and so on rather than "real" formal wear.