Military Historians, I need help

**Malcolm MacWilliam** · 19th July 09, 04:29 AM

Just happened to pop in and saw this post....the 23rd officer is a good friend of mine, although I won't ID him. The first photo you have of him is at Williamsburg, probably this year as he was Officer of the Guard and I was Sjt. of the Guard on the day the photo was taken. The second photo at Yorktown is the same 23rd officer and the Major of the 42nd RHR, also a good friend of mine. IN fact, in the photo at Yorktown, I am off to their right, out of the photo, as I remember the photos being taken. That was at the 225th anniv. of Yorktown where I was serving as Army Sjt. Major. YES, to the answer of the Gorget and they are only worn when an officer is on duty.

Malcolm MacWm., 42nd RHR GrenCoy
ASM, British Brigade
www.britishbrigade.org

**MacMillan of Rathdown** · 19th July 09, 10:41 AM

Interestingly, a silver gorget is worn by the President of the Saint Andrew's Society of Washington DC-- I don't know how to down load pictures, but if one googles the Society they will see photos of the gorget worn in modern times.

**Dall_Piobaire** · 19th July 09, 11:06 AM

Everyone has been spot on, but I was under the impression it was from the breast plate, not a piece to protect the throat. I am not sure but I think, in amcient armour, the throat and under the arms were some of the only chinks in the armour, so to speak.

Seeing those pics, always makes me want to jump back in with a vengence. Let me tell ya though, Todd knows this, wearing full regimentals here in the south is murder. we actually had reenactors fall from heat stroke durning reenactments at Cowpens and such places.

**MacMillan of Rathdown** · 19th July 09, 11:11 AM

The gorget is that piece of plate armour between the helmet and the breastplate. As both the helmet and breastplate were rendered obsolete the gorget remained as an indicator that the wearer was on duty. It is not restricted to the UK, and many armies in Europe and Latin America still wear this last vestige of armour.

**Nervous Jock** · 19th July 09, 11:17 AM

.............

**MacMillan of Rathdown** · 19th July 09, 11:42 AM

Sorry, but the quote you've posted isn't by me. You might want to try that again.

**Nervous Jock** · 19th July 09, 01:32 PM

Originally Posted by Bigkahuna

. In full dress he would be wearing a Bearskin cap similar but slightly smaller than a Grenadier's.

as in Grenadier Guards?

**Tim Little** · 19th July 09, 07:39 PM

Originally Posted by MacMillan of Rathdown

Interestingly, a silver gorget is worn by the President of the Saint Andrew's Society of Washington DC-- I don't know how to down load pictures, but if one googles the Society they will see photos of the gorget worn in modern times.

Here you go:

From: http://www.saintandrewsociety.org/photoalbum.htm

**Bigkahuna** · 20th July 09, 09:48 AM

Originally Posted by Nervous Jock

as in Grenadier Guards?

Similar but of 18th Century pattern. The 23rd was a Fusilier Regiment and all the men were outfitted in Bearskin headgear except the Left Flank or Light Infantry company. The Right Flank or Grenadier Company worn slightly larger bearskins. Bearskin headgear is still worn today by the Fusilier Regiments and if you can find a picture you will see that theirs are slightly smaller than the one worn by the Guards Regiments. Hope that helps.

**Tim Little** · 20th July 09, 10:15 AM

Originally Posted by Bigkahuna

Similar but of 18th Century pattern. The 23rd was a Fusilier Regiment and all the men were outfitted in Bearskin headgear except the Left Flank or Light Infantry company. The Right Flank or Grenadier Company worn slightly larger bearskins. Bearskin headgear is still worn today by the Fusilier Regiments and if you can find a picture you will see that theirs are slightly smaller than the one worn by the Guards Regiments. Hope that helps.

Here are more pix from the RWFIA site, not that I can vouch for historical accuracy: