How Is Guy Fawkes Night Celebrated?

[Pleater]

It has always bothered me that, as the Government held a monopoly on gunpowder in the time around 1605, how was it possible for the plotters to lay their hands on 36 barrels of the stuff in the run up to the opening of Parliament?

Did they actually HAVE gunpowder, or just a load of apple barrels that fell off the back of a cart and were sold to the first gull that landed?

Were they encouraged into believing that they could organise an explosion by a sting operation in order for it all to be uncovered at the last minute and so send the country into a frenzy over Catholic plots?

Anne the Pleater :ootd:

[Schiehallion]

[QUOTE=O'Callaghan;918930]Nobody mentionned bobbing for apples, or toasting sausages in the bonfire on the end of a stick.

Bobbing for apples is not a 5th of November tradition and is more associated with Hallow'een but may have slipped in. I would think it very unlikely as you need to see the fireworks and the bonfire at night, not have ones head in a bucket of water! Mind you it would be useful to have a bucket of water to but out a rougue fire.

[Lallans]

It has always bothered me that, as the Government held a monopoly on gunpowder in the time around 1605, how was it possible for the plotters to lay their hands on 36 barrels of the stuff in the run up to the opening of Parliament?

Did they actually HAVE gunpowder, or just a load of apple barrels that fell off the back of a cart and were sold to the first gull that landed?

Were they encouraged into believing that they could organise an explosion by a sting operation in order for it all to be uncovered at the last minute and so send the country into a frenzy over Catholic plots?

Anne the Pleater :ootd:

Not to say it was or was not a setup, but black powder is readily made from three common ingredients. On this side of the Atlantic, folks on the frontier often did make their own. First, if necessary, you collect and dry all your pee....

[Bugbear]

I was in the Cub Scouts for a couple of years around the age of ten, but I had to leave the Scouts before we learned anything about that... I don't even recall learning how to make a camp fire by rubbing sticks together...

Perhaps that was covered in the 4H activities; my father didn't want my brother and me to be involved in 4H though.

[Pleater]

I know how to make gunpowder - which makes me all the more perplexed about how the conspirators obtained the ingredients - OK the saltpeter coud be got, charcoal, probably no problem - but the Sulphur?

If I remember correctly, when on the run from the authorities their stock of gunpowder for their pistols got wet in the rain so when they found shelter and lit a fire they spread it out on the hearth to dry. The resulting explosion severely injured several and burnt everyone in the room.

That level of expertise in handling gunpowder does make me suspect that they did not have an NVQ in the safe storage of explosives.

(NVQ - national vocational qualification - low grade certificate, I think there is one which includes using a stapler)

I am quite willing to believe that there were people who would sit around a good fire, drinking and considering how to blow up the King and Parliament, and the better the ale the more fanciful the plan, but - well - maybe I am just getting cynical in my old age.....

Anne the Pleater :ootd:

[Mike_Oettle]

In Cape Town there used to be a tradition among the Coloured people (boys of schoolgoing age) of putting a “guy” on a barrow or cart of some sort and trundling it around better-off neighbourhoods, singing a little song that is characteristically “Capie”.
I used to hear it every year at the beginning of October.
I should explain that the term Capie is used to describe Coloured folk from Cape Town (they use it of themselves, and I use it of myself in a sort of self-derotagory way). They also speak a dialect that is a mixture of English and Afrikaans.
I heard a radio interview some years ago with a social worker who came out from England about 40 years ago and immediately began working with Coloured people. He learned his Afrikaans from them, and it often horrified the Stellenbosch professors with whom he occasionally associated.
(For those who don’t know, Stellenbosch is not only the oldest town in South Africa, but also the seat of the Afrikaans-language university in the Western Cape. The town has been a centre of education since the early 19th century.)
The social worker realised after a number of years that he was dealing with a unique form of language, and began to note down usages unique to what is known as Capie-taal. These he would then check with knowledgeable Coloured folk from various parts of the Peninsula and the Boland.
Eventually he produced a dictionary of the dialect.
After all that explanation, here are the words they would sing:

Jack an’ Jill went up da hill to fetch a pail of water
Guy het nie hare nie, Guy het nie hare nie,
Guy het nie hare nie, so early in de morning.

Why they sang about someone who had no hair, I have no idea (perhaps they didn’t bother to put a wig or some straw on their dummy).
At any rate, singing this song would invariably produce a few pennies, perhaps a tickey (silver 3d piece) or a sixpence. One presumed they spent it on fireworks, but we never did find out!
Regards,
Mike

[Lallans]

I know how to make gunpowder - which makes me all the more perplexed about how the conspirators obtained the ingredients - OK the saltpeter coud be got, charcoal, probably no problem - but the Sulphur?

If I remember correctly, when on the run from the authorities their stock of gunpowder for their pistols got wet in the rain so when they found shelter and lit a fire they spread it out on the hearth to dry. The resulting explosion severely injured several and burnt everyone in the room.

That level of expertise in handling gunpowder does make me suspect that they did not have an NVQ in the safe storage of explosives.

(NVQ - national vocational qualification - low grade certificate, I think there is one which includes using a stapler)

I am quite willing to believe that there were people who would sit around a good fire, drinking and considering how to blow up the King and Parliament, and the better the ale the more fanciful the plan, but - well - maybe I am just getting cynical in my old age.....

Anne the Pleater :ootd:

I'm not an authority on England in that period, but I rather suspect that sulfur was commonly used as a fumigant, worming medicine, and gun powder ingredient then just as it was in later centuries; I therefore don't see how the Crown could have had a monopoly on black powder. However, here in Canada some Al Q conspirators were sold several tons of inert powder instead of the ammonium nitrate they thought they were purchasing so perhaps the secret service of the day did that to Guy- but whatever, he ended up taking the jump.

[Arlen]

When I was wee it was very much a local community event. The parents in a specific neighborhood would chip in to get the fireworks and we'd all help get the bonfire built up.
People would bring along bonfire toffee, toffee apples and potatoes to bake in the embers of the bonfire.
The bairns would make a guy and take it around the neighbourhood beforehand to get money for their own wee fireworks.

It's a bit bigger and more city organized now, but still a lot of fun.

It's the one holiday I insisted I still get to celebrate after moving to America. We invite all of our friends over, have a big pot luck and the bonfire and guy and set off fireworks. I always make bonfire toffee and we usually make spiced cider and baked potatoes and corn as well.

If we get a chance, we'll even get everyone over to watch gunpowder, treason and plot beforehand!

[Lallans]

When I was wee it was very much a local community event. The parents in a specific neighborhood would chip in to get the fireworks and we'd all help get the bonfire built up.
People would bring along bonfire toffee, toffee apples and potatoes to bake in the embers of the bonfire.
The bairns would make a guy and take it around the neighbourhood beforehand to get money for their own wee fireworks.

It's a bit bigger and more city organized now, but still a lot of fun.

It's the one holiday I insisted I still get to celebrate after moving to America. We invite all of our friends over, have a big pot luck and the bonfire and guy and set off fireworks. I always make bonfire toffee and we usually make spiced cider and baked potatoes and corn as well.

If we get a chance, we'll even get everyone over to watch gunpowder, treason and plot beforehand!

Do you still play conkers then? I know a Brit expat who would go on and on about how great a game it was. But he never played it himself, here, or organized his kids to do so.

[Drac]

I remember sulfer being used as a wound dressing but not sure when that started.

Jim