craftsmen/artisans vs Cheap goods

[Shanntarra]

Last night myself and a contractor friend of mine got a bee in our bonnets about this topic. Lately we both have been running into people who want the quick and dirty price for hand made quality goods/services.

Example for myself. A girl wants me to make her a custom ball gown but expected only to pay $30 bucks for it (supplies included). When i told her she was looking at least at $100 for supplies alone, much less paying for my time she was livid. She could go to the mall and get a simular dress for $50. The problem is that dress won't fit her correctly and will fall apart soon as a breeze hits it.

Example for Barty: He had a contract for a project. He was forced to hire two guys who didn't know anything about the projects because they said they could do it for $10 an hour less than their normal guy. This saved the company money. Now they guys are doing shoddy work, or just plain wrong. They are taking 2x the time to do it. Their answer when asked, Don't you care about your work? was "Why should we care? It isn't like WE have to live in the house when we are done. It is just a job."

Example for my Rogue: He fell in love with this hand forged, hand sharped knife. Given his job he likes to have a good one in hand. He saved his money and got it. When he showed it to some friends of ours they freaked when they heard what he paid for it. Why should you pay good money for something hand crafted by an artisan? That blade is a useable, functioning piece of art. Why is that a bad thing to give an artisan work?

Given the different back grounds of the people here, I wanted to hear some of your thoughts and opinions on this topic.

[walkerk]

Words from my father: "There is no such thing as a cheap tool. You will pay for its use one way or another." A lesson often only learned with age and experience, it can be applied to most goods.

[JRB]

This happens all the time. Our modern era of cheap (and cheaply made) mass produced goods has conditioned the general populous to expect everything to be inexpensive. For the most part, cheaply made goods will suffice folks for their basic needs (a $35 DVD player, for instance). Unfortunately, that leaves true craftsmanship looking over priced and out of reach. People rarely take into account that not only are custom made hand crafted goods generally nicer overall than cheap mass produced stuff, they also last a hell of a lot longer. If that's a priority to you then paying more will make sense. A lot of the personal value comes from the pride in owning an heirloom quality product. Most people I know couldn't care less about pride of ownership.

[ForresterModern]

No question our society, at least on this side of the pond, has gotten into a "MacDonalds mentality" ( the restaurant chain, not the clan) about virtually everything, I want it fast and I want it cheap, and quality in general has gone out the window, so much so that people now think the norm is the poor quality we are all pretty much getting. True quality workmanship now stands out above the rest but only for those who are actively seeking it out, and who are willing to not only hear the higher price thereof but also willing to pay it. I see it in my medical practice every day in dozens of different areas, and life in general just as frequently if not more so.

Xmarks is studded with fine artisans, as well as a large percentage of members who have or at least are developing the keen eye to recognize that quality, and its true value in the long run. That is one of the reasons I am here, to interact with and meet great foklk with great talents, and to learn from them the details of quality so that I can truly appreciate it when I see it or go shopping for it. Thanks to all the artisans here on xmarks for showing us your wares and skills.


jeff

[Dall_Piobaire]

You see this kind of thing everywhere, in everything. People have come to want, and expect, the quickie fix, the immediate satisfaction of the thing. Kilts, kilts have always been expensive, always. All good highland wear has always been expensive. But, there was more likely than not a time when it was well "made" as opposed to mass manufactured. People owned one suit, because a tailored suit was expensive. Come mass manufacturing, the suits were cheap but shoody, you just bought another when the previous one turned to rags. This suited the manufacturer just fine, he made more money. His deal became making money, not making a quality product!

I remember remarking how typical it was that so many of the old, well built homes survived major hurricanes with only broken windows; while the newly "manufactured" homes, the better this, better that, were flattened to the ground.

It really should come down to being that you get what you pay for, but you can't even rely on that any more.

I will always support the craftspeople first if I possibly can. FOr a crafter/artisan, in my opinion, it is a love of what they do that comes first. Pride in their work. Oft times they put their name on their work, as they should. It's an expression of who they are and what matters to them. As what they do is a labor of love, and pride, I should be willing to sacrifice and save to acquire it. If it is worth having it is worth working for

[Chas]

We always used to say: "You buy cheap - you buy twice."

Regards

Chas

[macwilkin]

We always used to say: "You buy cheap - you buy twice."

Regards

Chas

In a similar vein:

I do not prize the word "cheap." It is not a badge of honor. It is a symbol of despair. Cheap prices make for cheap goods; cheap goods make for cheap men; and cheap men make for a cheap country.

-- President William McKinley

[budd4766]

Being a leather worker, I get this all the time. I've made cell phone cases as gifts for friends, and then they'll ask me to make them another one so they can give it away...usually, I turn to my wife and ask, "What're we getting for these now? About $80 or so, isn't it?", and they go all wall-eyed.

People we know make leather earrings and other jewelry, and get noses turned up at them when they want to charge more than $5 for their hand-crafted work.

Not many people appreciate everything that goes into creating something like that. It's ridiculous, but sadly, a fact of life.

[MacAngus]

I have a similar problem.
When I get asked to play pipes I charge a pretty good fee around $300
I tell them I charge my price because i have gone on tour with the chieftains and have played at carnagie hall.
They usually say well the other guy is cheaper and I tell them that he will not sound as good as i do.
People pay hundreds for a dj to put cd's in a machine but don't want to pay the piper why is that?
bagpiping is an art form that's just as memorable if not more than the thousands they pay for flowers.
why do you guys think that is?

[Piper]

I do a bit of leatherwork, horn work and occasionally some woodworking. Lately I've also started dabbling in iron (friend gave me a forge). What I make is generally for the Rendezvous and Reenactment circuit. I've found that the serious reenactors and renezvousers understand the basis for a fair price on handmade goods. It's the casual participants who are looking for the WalMart pricing. I do this as a hobby, very small production. If I find a suitable hide cheaply enough, I might make 2 or 3 sporrans for example. I rarely even try to sell anything anymore. Most of what I make winds up being given to friends, or given out as prizes at various events. My thought on the matter is that I enjoy the making much more than the having.
Value is a teachable concept though. Earlier today I was overseeing my 12 year old grandson as he poured a pewter bolster and pommel for his first hand forged knife (he did the forge work as well). He told me "PopPop, now I understand why the good knives at Rendezvous cost so much. This takes a lot of time and work."
Regarding the piping, I really think most people only look at the time we are actually on location playing. They completely disregard the time and money spent on kit, instrument, lessons, etc. Why we seem to be the only ones subject to this selective blindness is a mystery to me.