Identify this tartan?

[Andrew Breecher]

I found an amazing deal on some P/V tartan - $4.99 a yard. I like this asymmetrical tartan, but have no idea what it is. Any thoughts? I'm tempted to go back to the store and get some of the other offerings, just because the price is so good.

[davidlpope]

I found an amazing deal on some P/V tartan - $4.99 a yard. I like this asymmetrical tartan, but have no idea what it is. Any thoughts? I'm tempted to go back to the store and get some of the other offerings, just because the price is so good.

Unnamed fashion tartan.

[Andrew Breecher]

That's what I figured.

[tundramanq]

It isn't a tartan as it has no "pivot point" of symmetry that seems mandatory to do double width weaving and splicing for kilts.

For an 8 yard kilt you will need all 8 yards regardless of how wide the fabric is rather than 4 yards ripped and spliced.
Also look at the weight and the selvage. Kilt selvages are discreet so that no hem is needed.
The red stripe on this one is a selvage marker. You would be forced to hem and end up with greatly reduced pleat action.

The stripe isn't always there but you can see how ragged the edges are - this has to be hemmed under or otherwise bound.
The fabric wrinkles in the picture tend to indicate a lighter weight cloth than kilt weight. ( 13 oz. and up )
They are welcome to advertise it as "kilt" fabric but it isn't.

I shop a lot on eBay and have learned to look real close at the pictures to see if the description agrees....
If dishonest and "smart", they could have straightened the fabric and missed shooting the selvage.
If they muffed it this much, I wonder of they ever spelled out P/V as Polyester and Viscose(rayon)? Fabric weight?

[figheadair]

It isn't a tartan as it has no "pivot point" of symmetry that seems mandatory to do double width weaving and splicing for kilts.

Don't confuse symmetric and asymmetric tartans with the commrrcial practice of economic weaving, it maks no difference to the integrity of the design to have an unwoven central section. It just means that the cloth cannot be used as a whole piece in the traditional manner.

For an 8 yard kilt you will need all 8 yards regardless of how wide the fabric is rather than 4 yards ripped and spliced.

Why? That's how a great many modern kilts are made.

The red stripe on this one is a selvage marker.

There is no such thing as a 'selvedge marker', either it's a selvedge or it isn't. What you mean to say is that it's the unfinished edge marker.

[Andrew Breecher]

I have several poly/viscose kilts which have a fringed bottom edge instead of a straight selvedge. I know that isn't traditional, but neither is P/V. I therefore only bought 5 yards, so that I can still use it as a double-width cloth.

There are also "real" tartans which are asymmetrical, so I'm not sure what you mean that it isn't a real tartan. I never said this was heavy-weight wool. I stated in my original post that I know it's poly/viscose (probably 10 or 12 oz), and that I know it's asymmetrical.

Asymmetrical tartans:
http://www.tartansauthority.com/tart...etric-tartans/
Buchanan
Barb talks about pleating asymmetrical tartans

[tundramanq]

I hope both sides are good. If you rip the center on this, to align the patterns you will have to use the back side on one half if you wish to use the selvage it has without hemming.

Did some more mental gymnastics.... Think the splice will be all right side but half the "hem" will be selvage edge and the other the ripped edge. The asymmetry precludes any "rotation". --- coffee required. Used to thinking keeping selvage aligned is also "king".

Asymmetric Welsh tartans can't play the rip and flip game at all - can they? Or are they just non-square.

Does the STA let the warp and weft thread counts be different?

[Andrew Breecher]

I won't want to use the selvedge it has. It looks terrible. I'm going to put a small (1/4") fringe along the bottom edge (similar to the fringe at the edge of the apron), and I'll be able to use the front of both halves of the cloth.

Here is a picture of Hamish wearing a kilt with a fringed edge, in the style that I mean:



(from this thread)

[tundramanq]

I won't want to use the selvedge it has. It looks terrible. I'm going to put a small (1/4") fringe along the bottom edge (similar to the fringe at the edge of the apron), and I'll be able to use the front of both halves of the cloth.

Here is a picture of Hamish wearing a kilt with a fringed edge, in the style that I mean:



(from this thread)

This is neat! It gives me ideas for the military pleat kilt I have that is 3 inches too long. I did a 400% blowup and can see no stitch line. Do you or does Hamish know how this is kept from further unwanted raveling?

[Andrew Breecher]

Well this has moved far beyond the original title of the post, so perhaps the thread should be moved. I'll leave that up to the admins.

I wanted to show two P/V kilts that I own, with their fringe edges. The top one is from USA Kilts, and is the semi-traditional in the St. David's tartan (also, as it happens, an asymmetrical tartan). Because of the tenterhook holes along the entire edge, it looks as though this is the selvage, but it's still fringed. There is an additional line of white stitching to hold the fringe in place.

The bottom one is a Bear Kilt, in the Ramsay (Blue) tartan. You can see the zig-zag stitching holding the fringe in place.

Interestingly, both of these kilts are a single length of cloth. I wonder if the next St. David's kilt Rocky made had the sett reversed as he used the other half of the cloth.